Two tickets in my own space

Coupon-mad

Agreed. Every case differs though.

Best scenario would be if the OP paid a tenner or so for the permit and signed something they still have a copy of, which refers to the 'obligation' to display a permit but does not define the £ sum of any parking charge/fine.

Awooll

So I need to submit this today as my deadline is tomorrow.

I have amended the NTK points and searched around for unclear signage help but can't find anything.

When I collected the permit from the HA I just had to sign to say I had collected it and there was no fee. The HA claim they sent out a letter in advance telling us what was happening, I didn't receive it but they have sent me a copy and it just says we will be fined if we don't display a permit but not how much.

I know I should be writing something about the contract to park and changing the GPEOL/loss point but lack the understanding to know what to say.

trisontana

Did they actually say "fined" in that letter?

Awooll

trisontana wrote: »

Did they actually say "fined" in that letter?

Here's the letter:

http://s27.postimg.org/nheqesbhf/image.png

trisontana

Could you point out to Mr Hudson that they can't "fine" you as they are not the courts or the police.

Half_way

Have you done anything to contact the management company and demand that they cancel the charges?
1: protect yourslef, tell the management company to FRO, you dont agree to a private parking company being present and also inform them that you are/will only displaying a permit at your own discretion.
Also demand that they tell you exactly what statutory powers they have to issue fines, and if they have no such lawful authority ( which they dont) then you consider the letter to be misleading at best, if not fraudulent .
You should also demand that they contact all residents appologising for the misleading letter referencing fines, with a full redaction stating that private companies, such as the management company, any private parking company and / or individuals do not have any authority to issue fines or penalties

Awooll

Half_way wrote: »

Have you done anything to contact the management company and demand that they cancel the charges?
1: protect yourslef, tell the management company to FRO, you dont agree to a private parking company being present and also inform them that you are/will only displaying a permit at your own discretion.
Also demand that they tell you exactly what statutory powers they have to issue fines, and if they have no such lawful authority ( which they dont) then you consider the letter to be misleading at best, if not fraudulent .
You should also demand that they contact all residents appologising for the misleading letter referencing fines, with a full redaction stating that private companies, such as the management company, any private parking company and / or individuals do not have any authority to issue fines or penalties

Yes I have done this.
I'm at POPLA stage now, submitting my appeal today.

Coupon-mad

You do not have to rush your POPLA appeal, it still goes through a couple of days late.

Every single POPLA appeal here has 'unclear signage' in it so where have you been looking? Please don't say you submitted this to POPLA without saying anything about the signs or lack of contract formed from the unclear terms?

I sincerely hope you atached this as evidence:

http://s27.postimg.org/nheqesbhf/image.png

It shows the permits were supplied and accepted, forming a contract but with L&Q not the parking company and which gives away the rationale behind the charge is penal (which makes it an unenforceable penalty) but does not give any notice/adequate notice of the amount of the charge.

All of the above (including unclear signs without the charge in prominent 'large letters' (as was held in the Beavis case) is needed to show no contract was formed to agree to pay the charge.

Awooll

After five weeks of feeling miserable after my poor effort with my appeal I am astonished to find that both my appeals have been successful!
Thank you so much to everyone who contributed.

APPEAL 1

DecisionSuccessful

Assessor summary of operator case
The operator has failed to provide any evidence to support its reason for issuing the Parking Charge Notice (PCN).

Assessor summary of your case
The appellant's case is that on the day in question, the vehicle was parked in a residential car park and it does hold a valid permit, the space in which it was parked was for the sole use of that vehicle. The appellant states that they are not liable for the parking charge as the notice to keeper is not compliant with PoFA 2012, the vehicle belongs to a genuine resident, there is not contract to agree to pay £100 as there is inadequate signage, the charge is not a genuine pre-estimate of loss, the operator has no standing or authority to pursue charges nor form contracts with drivers and there is no contract between the driver and the operator.

Assessor supporting rational for decision
By issuing the appellant with a Parking Charge Notice, the operator has implied that the appellant has not complied with the terms and conditions of the car park in question. It is the duty of the operator to provide evidence to POPLA of the terms and conditions that the appellant did not comply with and evidence showing how the appellant did not comply with them. In this case, the operator has not provided any evidence to POPLA. As the operator has not provided a response to the appeal, it has not demonstrated that it issued the Parking Charge Notice correctly. Accordingly, I must allow this appeal.

APPEAL 2

DecisionSuccessful

Assessor summary of operator case
The operator has not provided any evidence to demonstrate that it has issued a valid Parking Charge Notice (PCN).

Assessor summary of your case
The appellant has raised the following grounds for appeal: • No keeper liability under schedule 4 – lack of NTK • Vehicle issued the CBC is considered to be a genuine resident • Unreasonable and unfair terms – no contract agreed to pay £100. • No genuine pre-estimate of loss • No standing or authority to pursue charges nor form contracts with drivers • No contract between driver and the operator

Assessor supporting rational for decision
The burden of proof lies with the operator to demonstrate that it has issued the Parking Charge Notice Correctly. As the operator has failed to provide any evidence in the appeal, I cannot conclude that the Parking Charge Notice is valid.

Guys_Dad

Can not understand PPCs who pay out £54 to POPLA and then don't bother to put in papers.

Not a business model I recognise!