Two tickets in my own space

Awooll

I hope I have posted this correctly.
Last week I was given two tickets in the space of three days by Ethical Parking Managment for not displaying my permit in my designated space.
They are members of BPA and POPLA.
I would be very grateful for any advice on what to put in my appeal.
I have read the introduction and want to appeal this week (within 14 days).
i don't think I can claim ownership of the land but the management have only recently employed EPM and apart from the signs we were not informed.

Fruitcake

Awooll wrote: »

I hope I have posted this correctly.
Last week I was given two tickets in the space of three days by Ethical Parking Managment for not displaying my permit in my designated space.
They are members of BPA and POPLA.
I would be very grateful for any advice on what to put in my appeal.
I have read the introduction and want to appeal this week (within 14 days).
i don't think I can claim ownership of the land but the management have only recently employed EPM and apart from the signs we were not informed.

Have you read the Sticky thread for NEWBIES yet? This explains how to appeal first to the parking company, and then to PoPLA if/when they reject it.


If you received windscreen tickets you should appeal around day 25 online or day 22 by post. Don't do it too soon as the idea is to make the parking company forget to send a POFA compliant notice to keeper.


Ignore the 14 day suckers' discount. Follow the advice to get the 100% MSE discount.


What does your lease say about parking permits? If it doesn't mention them then you do not have to display them.

HappyMJ

If you're renting the car parking space then the land/space is yours to park any car you want on it. You don't need a permit. That permit just makes it easier for them to figure out whether that car has your permission to park in your space or not.

If you weren't informed of the changes to the contract and certainly didn't agree to them then you don't have to abide by any changes your landlord has made to the contract.

Awooll

Yes I have read the NEWBIES post but was slightly confused.
My tickets are titled CBC (contractual breach charge) and the parking space is allocated to my flat which I part own and part rent from the housing association.
Below is the appeal wording from the NEWBIE post which fits my circumstances. I wanted to appeal within 14 days to have the discount payment option if I don't get a POPLA code.

Is this the one to use?

...and I will check the lease as soon as I get home but I am sure there is no reference to permits.

Date

Dear Sirs

Re: PCN No. ....................

I challenge this 'PCN' as keeper of the car and I will complain to the landowner about the matter if it is not cancelled.

I believe that the signs were not seen/are ambiguous and the terms unclear to drivers before they park. Further, I understand you do not own the car park and you have given me no information about your policy with the landowner or on site businesses, to cancel such a charge. So please supply that policy as I believe the driver may well be eligible for cancellation.

There will be no admissions as to who was driving and no assumptions can be drawn. You must either rely on the POFA 2012 and offer me a POPLA code, or cancel the charge.

I have kept proof of submission of this appeal and look forward to your reply.

Yours faithfully,

Ralph-y

What does your lease / ownership details/ land registry say about parking and or permits?

depending what it says you may want to add to the appeal ........

getting the POPLA code is the important thing , but in cases such as this .......... you may well end up doing several appeals a year as they come up with more and more ways to ticket you ...:eek:

good luck

Ralph:cool:

Coupon-mad

I wanted to appeal within 14 days to have the discount payment option if I don't get a POPLA code.

Seriously, you do NOT need to consider that bribe for a nanosecond. I would never tell a single person to pay Ethical - an absolute joke of a firm.

Ethical are a cinch to beat at POPLA stage and appealing around day 25 is a deliberate ploy as explained in the NEWBIES thread. You won't lose at POPLA if you follow the script and get assistance at POPLA stage (when you write that longer appal based on our examples) and again come back here, when (if) they send POPLA evidence to contest it at the last gasp.

You can have the final word at POPLA and I'd be astonished if you lose if you play it as 'keeper' as advised.

Guys_Dad

Were you told in advance by the Housing Association or managing agents about the new scheme coming in and were you issued with a permit? If no permit was issued, then the managing agent are at fault and they must get the tickets cancelled.

You also need to study your lease and see exactly what the managing agents/company are entitled to do and if that is a woolly catch all ability to bring in unspecified measures, then you may be in a slightly sticky situation if they have complied and you simply didn't use your permit.

there are loads of similar threads on here and many contributors give advice about the managing agents not being permitted to disturb your quiet peaceful enjoyment of your lease (by bringing in a PPC) but I have yet to read of any successful win either at POPLA or IAS and, in particular, a court when a resident has failed to display a permit contrary to the PPC t&c.

Don't get me wrong. I am 100% on your side but so far, I have not seen the "you don't need to comply if the lease doesn't mention parking" succeed anywhere. I am not, either, a PPC stooge!!

You just need to adopt other appeal points and see what other residents want as well as checking exactly what processes the landowner/agents followed by bringing in a PPC and making sure they were 100% rigorously following their mandates.

leeda84

Surely if the Housing Association AND the OP co-own the parking space, then it would require BOTH parties to have the contract with the PPC?

Look out for a covenant that suggests the managing agents can do whatever they want within reason across the development as that is what is written in my lease (but whether this extends to the private property or just the communal areas is a grey area). What is reasonable for someone is unreasonable for another and this can be argued with whoever employed the parking scumbags. Extortionate parking charges for parking in your own space is most definitely NOT reasonable.

Before you submit your appeal, go to whoever manages the development and demand the parking charges are cancelled.


My vehicle received a UKPC PCN for "not displaying a valid permit" whilst it was parked in my own private parking space which is part of my "property" on my lease. The PPC of course refused the first appeal and the charge was quashed at POPLA stage under the no contract with the landowner. I don't know if that was because they did not provide a contract at all or they didn't provide a copy because the contract would needed to have been signed by me (and that would NEVER happen).

The_Deep

HAs love these crooks, they probably get a rake off.


If the HA are a registered charity complain to HM Charity commissioners.

Awooll

Thank you for the replies. I will wait to appeal and plan my approach. Meanwhile I will write to the HA and demand the charges are cancelled.
Just in case it makes a difference I should add that the car is owned by my partner and I do have a permit. I will get more information about the lease and permit when I get home.

Coupon-mad

So it's owned by your partner. So your partner's name goes on the appeal, not yours, not the driver.