Parking Eye - poor signage?

kevanf1

Hi everybody. I wonder if you could offer me some advice. I have gone through the various notices written about private parking 'charges'. I shall have to go through them again as they started to 'swim' a bit in my head For now though, this is my problem.

On the 2nd January we (my family) went out to a local restaurant for a birthday meal for my wife. The car parking is controlled by Parking Eye. I drove onto the car park. No ticket is issued. It's been a long time (many years) since I last used this car park and I'm sure tickets had to be taken at the barrier. On this occasion there was no barrier on entry or exit. So, I drove onto the car park and parked in a disabled bay next to the restaurant. I did display my valid blue disabled badge. There are lots of signs displayed concerning the rules and regulations of parking. The trouble is the signs all start at about 8 foot up in the air. I have severe neck problems which mean I cannot raise my head more than a few degrees. I genuinely could not raise my head high enough to read these signs properly plus it was dark and absolutely throwing down with rain. I believed it said that parking was free from 5pm on Saturday and Sunday until sometime early in the morning. I could not see any other signs around and I also could not see any form of ticket machine. I am also unable to walk more than a few yards. The small distance I can walk takes me a long time and I am in constant pain (it is always there even sitting or lying down). I therefore truly believed that I was within the free parking time. We finished our meal and I drove out of the car park thinking nothing of it.

A week later I receive an invoice for £50 elevating to £85 if I do not pay within their specified time The invoice has photographic evidence of my car entering and leaving the car park at 5.01pm and 8.01pm respectively. I have not been able to go back to this car park and I realise that I do need to. I shall have to take somebody with me and take a photograph of the signage. My wife wonders if the 'free parking' might start at 6pm rather than 5pm. If this is the case then £50 does seem way over the top for one hours parking.

I must state right here that it was absolutely not my intention to try to get away with not paying for parking. I had even gone to the trouble of making sure I had a bag full of change with me. I will also add that by the end of the evening I was feeling very unwell and all I could really think of was getting back home. I did not have much to eat and I did not have any alcoholic drinks.

I do intend on appealing as I feel the signage is discriminatory to disabled persons. Any and all advice is very greatly appreciated. Thank you.

Coupon-mad

I would appeal online but not saying who was driving (say vaguely 'we went' not 'I' and call yourself the registered keeper ONLY in their drop-down menu).

State there were no signs at a low height with terms & times of charging, at the disabled bays and this is contrary to the BPA Code of Practice which requires a sign which can be read by people at the disabled bays without getting out of the car, otherwise no contract is formed.

Attach a copy of the Blue Badge and confirm it was displayed. Do not say who parked the car, so not 'I saw no signs...I parked...I displayed my...' NOPE. 'we'.

For an idea what to write, look at the blue font example of a short appeal in the NEWBIES thread, adapt that and submit the appeal online as 'registered keeper'. PE do cancel a number at this stage but if it is rejected, come back and we'll assist you with a decent POPLA appeal, likely to win.

You could also complain to the restaurant - if they are onsite, within the retail park - who may well have a phone number to cancel these on the spot.

kevanf1

Thank you so much for your time, help and advice I can confirm that the signs most certainly cannot be read from with the car. There is a very large sign directly in front of the disabled bays 'we' parked in. However, this is, as stated, something like 8 foot up in the air (the this is bottom of the sign where it starts). I have not measured this so it is purely a guess. It is certainly too high up for me to read but it was also too high for my wife to be able to read properly and she is not disabled.

I shall go ahead with the appeal and let you all know what happens.

Thank you once again.

Redx

appealing using the template letter is fine, but doesnt address the issues surrounding the EA2010 and your disability , hence why you should also complain to the restaurant as it says here

You could also complain to the restaurant - if they are onsite, within the retail park - who may well have a phone number to cancel these on the spot.

stand up for your rights as a disabled person, that is what the EA2010 is for

Ivor_Pecheque

Can you reveal the site (or at least the region.)

Lot's of people on here willing to take photos for you.

kevanf1

Sorry it has taken some time to respond to the contributors of this thread. I have simply been too unwell through both stress and illness to be able to do anything.

Firstly I did appeal to Parking Eye. Predictably they threw my appeal out. I am rather worried now because I can now appeal to the next level but if I lose that one then the charge that they wish to levy will go up from £50 to £85 I cannot afford £50 let alone the £85. I want to appeal to the next level but should I pay the £50 and then send my appeal in?

EA 2010. I did not know about this but it would seem that I am being discriminated against according to the legislation. I did not mention EA 2010 in my first appeal to Parking Eye, maybe I should have?



The car park in question is located in Walsall in the West Midlands at a shopping area called Crown Wharf.

Parking Eye have very graciously (hmm) given me a further 14 days to pay this charge at the 'lower' rate of £50.

I don't really know what to do now? I will be very grateful for any advice that is given. I will admit that I am sorely tempted to just pay up and be done with it as it is causing me a great deal of stress and is exacerbating my arthritis which is the reason I could not read there far too high signs

Just adding that I have not been able to contact the restaurant as yet but will try to do so tomorrow. I shall mention EA 2010 and the fact that I find the signage discriminatory.

Guys_Dad

If you send them £50, you can't appeal. End of.

So, make a decision that best suits you.

Coupon-mad

Not sure why you are concerned, we do know how to win at POPLA. That's what post #3 of the NEWBIES thread shows you, examples of POPLA appeals including at least one Pay and Display ParkingEye version.

Crown Wharf have signs reminding you to P&D (I've seen pics last year) but interestingly not all the signs mention the £85 and I seem to recall as you say, there isn't a clear P&D machine near the disabled bays near the restaurant.

You could try ringing the retail park or emailing Savills to see if they will quash the PCN as you are so worried and are disabled:

http://www.crownwharfshoppingpark.co.uk/contact/index.html

I recall asking Savills to cancel one there last year and under mitigating circs, they will consider it as a one-off in genuine cases.

kevanf1

Ok, this is the situation. I have just a few minutes ago phoned Crown Wharf on the number given on the above website, thank you 'Coupon-mad' for that information. The employee I spoke to informed me that the free parking time starts at 6:00pm not 5:00pm as I had thought. I reiterate, I thought it said 5:00pm was the start of free parking but I was unable to properly see the sign. It is sited high up (well above eye level) and part of my disability is the fact that I have severe, chronic arthritis in my neck and my lower spine. I am simply unable to lift my head more than about a degree or two. Add to this it was dark and it was pouring down with rain. This employee was unable to help further and simply gave me the number for 'head office'. I assumed this to be Crown Wharf management head office. Not so, this was for Parking Eye So, I then asked if there was anything that they could do to help me as I am at my wit's end and very worried about this. The woman I spoke to advised me to take my case to POPLA. So that is what I shall do.

Now, I have gone through the newbies thread. I am sorry but I can't find a letter template to use I may have missed something somewhere but I have honestly spent over an hour trying to find something to help. With this in mind I am going to draft my own letter to POPLA. Once it's done I shall post it here so that hopefully somebody can point out any errors. In the meantime could I have some suggestions of what to put in the letter please? My argument is that I am disabled. The signage is too high for a disabled person such as myself to see. I believe one of the legal requirements is that signage must be clearly visible and most importantly readable from the driver's seat. This is not the case for disabled drivers when parked in a disabled bay even if I did have full neck mobility. Secondly I believe that £50 rising to £85 for an unsuccessful appeal is grossly unfair considering that after 6:00pm parking was free anyway.

I also wish to point out that I am unable to walk without being in severe pain. That is not walking 5 metres or 10 metres that is walking altogether. I can walk with the aid of two crutches but it is extremely painful. With this in mind I could not see any ticket machines anywhere near the disabled parking bays that I used. I cannot walk around a quite large car park hunting down a ticket machine that may or may not have the parking rules and regulations on it. Again I feel this is discriminatory towards disabled people.

Is it worthwhile stating that I truthfully never intended to defraud the system and that I am quite happy to pay the standard parking rate of one hour whatever that may be?

I do appreciate the help I have been given so far, thank you all.

Coupon-mad

It is not a 'letter'. POPLA appeals are best submitted online. Choose 'OTHER' when you eventually submit it but show us your draft first.

I can never understand it when people can't see what to put in a POPLA appeal seeing as post #3 of the NEWBIES thread gives you at least one ParkingEye POPLA example which relates to a P&D car park. Copy from that - your case is the same - you do not have to find the exact same circumstances, just a Pay and Display reatil park example is close enough.

Here's one from today about a P&D car park (NOT PARKING EYE) where the appeal points are the same as yours:

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/5382607

Easy enough to crib from if you read the posts on that thread from TODAY ONLY. But the examples in the NEWBIES thread are good too.

Finally, you, your extended family and your friends etc should all be signing this petition

https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/111925

...if you haven't all done so already!

kevanf1

Again, my apologies for this being longer than I had wanted. I'm afraid I have been very ill again, nothing new with me.

I have set this out as a draft to submit to POPLA. Is this ok? Is there anything else I can add to it?

"Dear POPLA Assessor,

I am the registered keeper of vehicle registration xxxx xxx and I wish to appeal a recent parking charge number xxxxxxx/xxxxxx using POPLA appeal code xxxxxxxxxx. My appeal was refused by ParkingEye with no reason given for refusal.

I challenge this 'PCN' as keeper of the car as I believe that the signs were not seen/are ambiguous and the terms unclear to drivers before they park. To expand on this the signs with the parking terms and conditions are greatly above eye level unless one happens to be approximately 7 feet tall. Neither myself or my wife were able to read the signs properly. I am disabled in that I have severe arthritis. Part of this is in my neck vertebrae and is well documented in my medical records. Because of this arthritis in my neck vertebrae I am totally unable to move my head upwards more than about a degree. On the evening that the parking charge relates to it was dark and raining heavily, visibility was reduced because of this. I believed that the sign read free parking from 5pm. My wife also read it as this though I reiterate that it was absolutely not clear. It was not until approximately 4 weeks later after having spoken to an operative by telephone conversation at Crown wharf (the car park in question) that I was told the 'free parking' period starts at 6pm not 5pm. Again, I press the issue that the signage is not clear. It is my belief that is quite possibly discriminatory to disabled persons such as myself.

It was never our intention to attempt to defraud the system or to go against the terms and conditions of parking at Crown Wharf.

I am quite happy to pay whatever the hourly rate is for parking at Crown Wharf plus £5 administration fee. I do feel that the initial penalty charge of £50 now risen to £85 is grossly unfair and totally disproportionate to the one single hour that is actually in question."