Right of access denied

Davesnave

dc197 wrote: »

Shouldn't make any difference. My feeble elderly female neighbour came round to my house (I'm male) on the first week to say hello. New neighbours shoudl start off on the right foot.

What has feeble got to do with it?

Millie Dowler and Suzy Lamplugh weren't feeble.

Norman_Castle

danslenoir wrote: »

Also unfortunately, even if we choose to use the ROW anyway for the only real purpose we want to use it for (i.e. bins), we are often not able to do so at the times we need to if there are two cars parked on her driveway (often) as there is insufficient space for a wheelie bin to fit through. Can we insist that sufficient access for bins is made available on the days/times we want? There is no width specified on the ROW wording and I'm unsure where legally we stand on this.

http://www.boundary-problems.co.uk/boundary-problems/priv-r-o-w.html#private%20right%20of%20way%20on%20foot

A private right of way on foot permits you to:

• pass and repass on foot between the dominant tenement and the public highway;
• with or without a load that one person might be expected to be capable of carrying;
• or pushing a small barrow or trolley or perambulator, or wheeling (not riding) a bicycle, provided that the wheeled device is not too wide to be accommodated by the footpath and by any gates along the path.

moneyistooshorttomention

Norman_Castle wrote: »

http://www.boundary-problems.co.uk/boundary-problems/priv-r-o-w.html#private%20right%20of%20way%20on%20foot

A private right of way on foot permits you to:

• pass and repass on foot between the dominant tenement and the public highway;
• with or without a load that one person might be expected to be capable of carrying;
• or pushing a small barrow or trolley or perambulator, or wheeling (not riding) a bicycle, provided that the wheeled device is not too wide to be accommodated by the footpath and by any gates along the path.

Well - a wheelie bin isn't a "small barrow" or a "trolley" or a "perambulator" or a "bicycle" being wheeled.

So I would say its not covered by the wording of this.

You have been pushing and pushing to use this womans garden as a ROW whether she likes it or no.

If you try to now insist she cant even use her own drive as a drive because you want to push something along it that isn't one of the things specified then I foresee things getting very ugly very fast - as you try to go against the law and show no concern whatsoever for her rights. She is likely to start by specifying wheelie bins aren't covered by that wording and if you still try and push and push and push - you are likely to get a solicitor letter saying so and that you are perfectly at liberty to physically carry a binbag along her drive, provided you don't interfere with her using her own drive.

From what I've read of the law on using other peoples property - it doesn't take kindly to people blocking an owners use of their own property to suit a neighbour wishing to use it in an incompatible way (ie yourself).

iammumtoone

moneyistooshorttomention wrote: »

Well - a wheelie bin isn't a "small barrow" or a "trolley" or a "perambulator" or a "bicycle" being wheeled.

So I would say its not covered by the wording of this.

easily solved - OP get a small wheelbarrow/trolley, lift your wheelie bin into it, to push through your ROW

You have been pushing and pushing to use this womans garden as a ROW whether she likes it or no.

You seem to be missing the point it doesn't matter if the women likes it or not, her garden has a ROW across it for the OP to use, they are perfectly within their rights to use it. I think they have been very reasonable so far.

If you try to now insist she cant even use her own drive as a drive because you want to push something along it that isn't one of the things specified then I foresee things getting very ugly very fast - as you try to go against the law and show no concern whatsoever for her rights.

What about the OP rights to use their ROW, the women is certainly not considering that.

She is likely to start by specifying wheelie bins aren't covered by that wording and if you still try and push and push and push - you are likely to get a solicitor letter saying so and that you are perfectly at liberty to physically carry a binbag along her drive, provided you don't interfere with her using her own drive.

I agree the women does need to seek the advise of a solicitor as she clearly needs to be told by one, she is in the wrong and has to allow the OP to use their ROW

From what I've read of the law on using other peoples property - it doesn't take kindly to people blocking an owners use of their own property to suit a neighbour wishing to use it in an incompatible way (ie yourself).

OP is not using it in a incompatible way, they have ROW

Are you the lady next door? or are you in the same situation yourself, trying to stop someone using a ROW over your land?

When the house was purchased the ROW would have been there, if they did not want to allow access they should not have brought the house.

Davesnave

moneyistooshorttomention wrote: »

Well - a wheelie bin isn't a "small barrow" or a "trolley" or a "perambulator" or a "bicycle" being wheeled.

So I would say its not covered by the wording of this.

I think those are simply examples, pertinent at the time the legislation was drafted.

But in any event, isn't a wheelie bin a barrow for rubbish sacks?

moneyistooshorttomention

iammumtoone wrote: »

Are you the lady next door? or are you in the same situation yourself, trying to stop someone using a ROW over your land?

When the house was purchased the ROW would have been there, if they did not want to allow access they should not have brought the house.

No to all those questions. I'm not the neighbour and no-one has any ROW on my land.

I was a bit 50/50 to start with on this - but now it looks like OP is so determined to push those bins through that they don't care if the neighbour can even use their own drive as a drive - I've just made up my mind and my sympathies are entirely with the neighbour now.

iammumtoone

moneyistooshorttomention wrote: »

No to all those questions. I'm not the neighbour and no-one has any ROW on my land.

I was a bit 50/50 to start with on this - but now it looks like OP is so determined to push those bins through that they don't care if the neighbour can even use their own drive as a drive - I've just made up my mind and my sympathies are entirely with the neighbour now.

I read it as if the neigbour has only just started parking two cars on the drive since the meeting regarding the ROW, so read it as if it is the neighbour being deliberately disruptive.

Personally I think the OP is being fair they only want to use their ROW once a week when the bins are put out.

kev25v6

Easy enough for her to park to one side to allow access for the bins to get past on one day a week. It wouldn't inconvience her everyday of the week. There is a right of way over her land and you are entitled to use it. Nothing stopping you pushing a small barrow with your shopping in it up and down the drive every day if you really wanted too. She just doesn't want you to use her garden at all and not having a right of way on her garden would increase her house value.

ManuelG

I'm learning an advantage of new builds. The mid terrace next to me has a RoW for their bins, across the other end terrace. It's all nicely fenced off from new though, so nobody's in any doubt.

Now if the end terrace ever takes down that fence and/or moves out, and it all becomes muddy... glad the RoW isn't over mine, is all

Davesnave

moneyistooshorttomention wrote: »

I was a bit 50/50 to start with on this - but now it looks like OP is so determined to push those bins through that they don't care if the neighbour can even use their own drive as a drive - I've just made up my mind and my sympathies are entirely with the neighbour now.

iammumtoone wrote: »

I read it as if the neigbour has only just started parking two cars on the drive since the meeting regarding the ROW, so read it as if it is the neighbour being deliberately disruptive.

Personally I think the OP is being fair they only want to use their ROW once a week when the bins are put out.

I don't think we should be taking sides, nor can we presume that the neighbour is behaving differently just yet. Maybe the OP doesn't know.

However, quoting from Norman Castle's link:

"the owner of the dominant tenement cannot expect the route to be widened, strengthened or given extra headroom just because his needs have changed: he is entitled only to the width, weight or headroom that was envisaged at the time of grant of the right of way."

So, if the RoW envisaged use by someone pushing a barrow, that's what the OP is entitled to; no more and no less. If he normally requires that level of access just once a week, that would appear very reasonable, considering that he could request it at all times.

It may be that the driveway just isn't wide enough, in which case the neighbour needs to widen it sufficiently for the OP to pass, or provide an acceptable alternative route, or park somewhere else for an agreed time. They might not want to do any of these things, but they have a duty to the OP.