Log Cabin Planning Permission

Betwixen

I have sold my house and am looking to buy an alternative house. I am looking for a rural property with an independent annexe for my elderly parents.
In the viewing process, I have been to see one house that has a "log cabin" within the garden. Inside it is fantastic, and to all intents and purposes, an additional house. It is perfect, but that house wasn't for us.
So we started looking into options of buying a cheaper house ourselves and putting in a similar log cabin ourselves. We have had a look and prices seem to be around the £25,000 mark. Obviously there would be additional costs such as laying foundations and connecting utilities etc... however it looks like a great option - the biggest worry is planning permission (especially if we buy a property and then cannot get planning permission).

However, looking on the web sites for some of the Log Cabin sellers, the very clear implication is that planning permission is not required so long as basic conditions are met e.g. more than 2m from boundary, not overlooking neighbours, less than 4m high etc ... nothing that looks a problem.

I'm skeptical because it doesn't seem to make sense (to me) - afterall the players selling these cabins have a vested interest in playing down any planning issues, and if it really were that easy, with the housing crisis, these cabins would be literally everywhere wouldn't they? I feel I must be missing some important detail somewhere .... any thoughts?

Nobbie1967

I don't know the detail, but as long as the cabin is not occupied then it falls within permitted development as long as it meets certain criteria. If you want your parents to live there then I'm pretty sure you'll need planning permission and I suspect this will be difficult for the reasons you outline.

HouseBuyer77

I feel I must be missing some important detail somewhere .... any thoughts?

If it's a single room with a couple of seats and a desk then it's basically a glorified summer house so planners don't mind.

It's when you start making it usable as a bedroom they start getting interested. Bed, running water, heating, sink, toilet etc. Add a kitchen and shower and you've got entirely seperate dwelling definitely some form of planning permission required.

Betwixen

Yes I am talking about a full residential property - with Kitchen and Bedrooms.

I presume I cannot paste links - but here is one example of what a retailer says about planning permission. Their cabins are sold with kitchens and bedrooms - so the key is whether it is residential or not (which in my case it will be)?

Planning Permission Explained


We receive many calls from customers who are confused as to what the rules are with regards to log cabins and the planning permission issues that govern them.

The following is a guide we hope will help but please check with your local planning department as to your own personal circumstances to be absolutely sure if you need to obtain any consents.

Basically, you are entitled to have a log cabin in your garden up to 4m (13.4ft) in height. If that cabin is over 2.5m (8.25ft) in height and less than 2m (6.6ft) away from any boundary, you will most likely need permission.

The permission however, is likely to be granted as the law says you are entitled to go up to 4m in height.

The grey area is there because planning officers need to check each person’s circumstances before saying yes. For example, let us say you want to put a 4m high log cabin right up against your neighbour’s fence. One of the main concerns a planning officer has is ‘will this building adversely affect the neighbour’s use of his/her garden, block their sun or even intimidates them in any way’. If they decide it would, permission will be declined. Lowering the height in this instance to a level where the neighbour is not affected would most likely lead to the permission being approved.

If the log cabin is 2.5m or less in height, it is exempt from planning conditions and is therefore permitted development, even if it is close to the boundary.

At Cabins UK, most of our standard log cabins are 2.7m (8.9ft) high.

Customers who have placed our cabins close to their boundaries have all been given permission to do so by their local council. The main reason for this is because at that height, they have not adversely affected their neighbour.

For people who place their log cabins 2m or more away from the boundary, so long as the building is 4m or less in height, permission is not required.

(Properties that are in Areas of Outstanding Natural Beauty, Listed areas or protected areas have additional rules. If you live in an area such as these, you should check with your local planning department).

Being one of the largest suppliers of log cabins in Europe, Cabins UK can help all our customers in a number of ways with regards to the planning process.

Firstly, we have designed a few different log cabins which are 2.5m in height for customers who do not want to even think about the planning process.

Secondly, we offer a FREE service where we will make any of our standard range log cabins with a different angled roof so as to ensure they are 2.5m in height, making them exempt from the planning process.

As we will make these exclusively for each customer, please note the production time for this would be approx 4 weeks. (The Nottingham and the Duke log cabins are not included as, due to their design, lowering the roof to 2.5m is impossible).

HouseBuyer77

Take a look at: http://www.planningportal.gov.uk/uploads/miniguides/outbuildings/Outbuildings.pdf

To be permitted development, any new building must not itself be separate, self contained, living accommodation and must not have a microwave antenna.

You can also take a look at the planning portal: http://www.planningportal.gov.uk

Perhaps they claim they're not seperate living accomodation because they don't have a bed? I suspect the council may view it differently (add airbed and hey presto you can live there).

Building regulations will also come into play.

Freecall

The only question that matters is whether or not the structure is ‘Permitted Development’. Specifically, is it covered by the Town and Country Planning (General Permitted Development Order) 1995 (as amended)? You need to look at Schedule 2 which can be found here.

If it is permitted development then you can use it for any (domestic) use you wish provided that it is ancillary to the occupation of the host dwelling. If it isn’t then you will need planning consent.

So, if it is covered by PD, you can put granny in it, watch tv, sleep, cook or do any other thing that would be allowed in the rest of your house.

Before going ahead however, check that the Local Planning Authority has not removed any of the PD rights as part of an earlier planning consent since they sometimes do these days.

Betwixen

That looks a LOT more promising. There seem to be a lot of properties we are looking at which, at a glance, would allow us to comply with Class A.

My only hesitation (this isn't easy - I'm not a lawyer!! lol) is what counts as "enlargement" and what counts as a new property? Is it by definition "enlargement" of the existing property if it is within the curtilage?

EDIT And I suppose the other question - why the contradiction between the links from the last two posts? One saying its effectively allowed, the other that its not?

Freecall

Betwixen wrote: »

My only hesitation (this isn't easy - I'm not a lawyer!! lol) is what counts as "enlargement" and what counts as a new property? Is it by definition "enlargement" of the existing property if it is within the curtilage?

Yes, that is correct. The legislation is designed to ensure that new properties are not created. The building must ultimately be dependent on the host in some way and not entirely self-contained.

This is often achieved by having shared water, foul drainage systems or even power or heating. Perhaps a common access etc.

Betwixen wrote: »

And I suppose the other question - why the contradiction between the links from the last two posts? One saying its effectively allowed, the other that its not?

Not sure where they contradict?

teneighty

I would urge caution.

Generally outbuildings to be under permitted development must have an ancillary use to the dwelling it therefore cannot contain living accommodation, that is not ancillary.

So it can be a home gym or a study or a music room. It cannot be an extra bedroom and it certainly cannot be a self contained residential unit.

The way some people get round it is to build it with the "intention" of it being a home gym etc. Converting it to residential and then claiming lawful use after 4 years.

Alternatively go through a full planning application, granny annexes are often allowed with a condition about use by family members only.

Freecall

teneighty wrote: »

I would urge caution.

Caution is always wise.

teneighty wrote: »

So it can be a home gym or a study or a music room. It cannot be an extra bedroom

Neither the T&CPA nor the GPDO mentions any particular use, it simply must not be separate from the host dwelling.

teneighty wrote: »

The way some people get round it is to build it with the "intention" of it being a home gym etc. Converting it to residential and then claiming lawful use after 4 years.

Sounds awfully complicated to me. If certainty of the situation is sought, why not just apply for a Lawful Development Certificate? This would also have the added benefit of satisfying any future buyers of the property.

martindow

Freecall wrote: »

Sounds awfully complicated to me. If certainty of the situation is sought, why not just apply for a Lawful Development Certificate? This would also have the added benefit of satisfying any future buyers of the property.

You run the risk of someone local shopping you within the four years. You would be in a pickle if you were relying on using this as a granny flat.

Don't think the neighbours won't be aware of you building this no matter how secluded or remote you think it is.