Hybrid vs Diesel

snowscreamer

Pincher wrote: »

Mitsubishi Outlander PHEV.
No congestion charge, no road tax, low Company Car tax. Some free parking.

Petrol plug-in hybrid. The battery range is about 32 miles.

The ideal London commute vehicle, not so good for high milage use, though. If I was working, round trip to central London is about 16 miles.

I'll consider this but it looks like a fairly recent release - so I might struggle to find a 3-year-old used one? Commute is 22 miles each way at the moment, including two 5-mile motorway stretches.

snowscreamer

spinybif wrote: »

Beware the prius , just traded mine at 83,000 as started using excessive oil, common problem with Toyota engines as they get older, mpg around 53 mixed motorway/ town driving. New car golf diesel, easily getting 65mpg, car cost 4k less than same age Prius bought 4 years ago. Vote for diesel, just need to worry about vw emissions troubles.

Sorry to hear that. We drove one for 1000+ miles with a similar mileage (2013 model) last year and it was getting almost 80 MPG so might be the luck of the draw? I'm still torn on diesel given our relative lack of motorway miles on a day-to-day basis.

[Deleted User]

Hi,

Volkswagon seem to be getting a lot of publicity just now, so must be popular, check them out.

bigjl

snowscreamer wrote: »

Sorry to hear that. We drove one for 1000+ miles with a similar mileage (2013 model) last year and it was getting almost 80 MPG so might be the luck of the draw? I'm still torn on diesel given our relative lack of motorway miles on a day-to-day basis.

I have to say that I have never heard anybody complain about Prius oil consumption.

Maybe it is due to the way everybody I know of with a Prius uses there vehicle.

All are Minicab drivers in London, most reliable PH vehicle bar none. Most have done hundreds of thousands of miles in them, caveat being most are fairly new, but still hit 120/150k in three years, then get sold on to other Minicab drivers.

The Honda Insight is also decent and is a bit cheaper to buy.

gzoom

snowscreamer wrote: »

However, since the VW diesel saga and the ensuing fallout, I'm starting to reconsider... plus the creeping demonisation of diesel vehicles by the press / government eg. plans to ban them from city centres - making me uneasy.

I should add I work in a hospital day in and day out. I see people with end-stage (about to die) lung disease nearly every day. The damage caused by smoking, asbestos, paint, coal, silicon, takes DECADES to show up. Once the damage is done, there is no going back, no amount of compensation buys your good health, and dying from not been able to breath is to put it frankly - sad/awful, the fact its all avoidable makes it even worse. Saving £5 now due to better MPG is almost pointless if the end result is irreversible lung damage 20 years down the line, or even worse, 20 years down the line for your kids.

It takes smoking 25 years to show damage to your lungs, and we know exposure is directly linked to worse outcomes.

The emissions laws have been getting tighter for a reason, because its only now we are starting to see understand the issues around NO and other small particles released by diesel cars.

What VW had done is nothing sort of showing a complete disregard for long term human health, but instead choosing to chase after profits...Some one at the top sanctioned this course of action, though we may never know exactly who. But do you really want to buy a product from a company with such disregard for the rules in order to chase after the ££ in your pocket??

http://www3.epa.gov/airquality/nitrogenoxides/health.html

thescouselander

snowscreamer wrote: »

A petrol car is prohibitively expensive to run compared to hybrid or diesel. Quick calculations show over 5 years including repairs (average), fuel cost, depreciation:

VW Golf 1.6 TDI BlueMotion (diesel) - £12700
VW Golf 1.4 TSI (petrol) - £16850
Toyota Prius 1.8 VVTi (hybrid) - £15400

The reliability on Toyota hybrids is excellent, better than most petrol cars it just wouldn't make sense to go for a petrol over a hybrid...

Even if his OH's commute shortens and he does 10000 miles per year the petrol still comes out more expensive:

VW Golf 1.6 TDI BlueMotion (diesel) - £10500
VW Golf 1.4 TSI (petrol) - £13700
Toyota Prius 1.8 VVTi (hybrid) - £13100


It might make sense to get a diesel over a hybrid (that's what I'm debating) but it certainly wouldn't make sense to get a petrol car...

I don't recognise those figures at all having just done a similar calculation myself, allbeit on a larger car. I don't tend to use the published figures though and instead I go on the figures I have recorded myself. To give some specifics - my current Mazda 6 diesel does the same miles per tank as my previous petrol Audi A4 and both have similar sized tanks. The difference it diesel cars often need servicing more often making them more expensive. If you belive the published figures this shouldn't be the case but it absolutely is in real life.

I also have extensive records from driving all kinds of hire cars (both petrol and diesel) through work. I can say with very high confidence the difference between petrol and diesel is not that big and certainly not as high as is often claimed.

snowscreamer

thescouselander wrote: »

I don't recognise those figures at all having just done a similar calculation myself, allbeit on a larger car. I don't tend to use the published figures though and instead I go on the figures I have recorded myself. To give some specifics - my current Mazda 6 diesel does the same miles per tank as my previous petrol Audi A4 and both have similar sized tanks. The difference it diesel cars often need servicing more often making them more expensive. If you belive the published figures this shouldn't be the case but it absolutely is in real life.

I also have extensive records from driving all kinds of hire cars (both petrol and diesel) through work. I can say with very high confidence the difference between petrol and diesel is not that big and certainly not as high as is often claimed.

So far in my experience the diesel cars have way outperformed petrol in terms of MPG... I can believe you that servicing and repairs are more expensive for diesel though. Suspect hybrid beats both

bigjl

snowscreamer wrote: »

So far in my experience the diesel cars have way outperformed petrol in terms of MPG... I can believe you that servicing and repairs are more expensive for diesel though. Suspect hybrid beats both

Those figures are likely not relevant as the 1.6diesel VAG vehicle obtained those MPG returns by using illegal software.

In real day to day use most family sized diesels hit mid 50's.

The only real advantage to a diesel car is fuel economy, they are noisy round town and on tickover. Diesels used to be robust and reliable of agricultural.

Now if you want a simple durable vehicle you go for a much simpler petrol engine.

I have just bought my first petrol family car since 2008.

It was strange opening the bonnet to be confronted with huge amounts of unused space, you could almost stand under the bonnet!

The oil filter doesn't require the skills of a proctologist to find, you could probably do the Cambelt with almost no dismantling.

I will miss the low down surge of a diesel.

At motorway speeds it is quieter than I expected aswell.

spinybif_2

Those are real figures, average 70.3 mpg, 17 mile journey each way to work on mixed motorway / A road driving. Same route in prius averaged 53.4 mpg.

Regarding oil consumption of prius, google it, they are planning a class action against Toyota in the States.

bigjl

spinybif wrote: »

Those are real figures, average 70.3 mpg, 17 mile journey each way to work on mixed motorway / A road driving. Same route in prius averaged 53.4 mpg.

Regarding oil consumption of prius, google it, they are planning a class action against Toyota in the States.

I don't pay any attention to what US consumers think warrants a class action suit to be honest.

I have loads of friends that work in PH, not just drivers, company owners, directors of companies (Addison Lee) aswell as drivers.

When a vehicle has a common problem it makes it out into the public domain fairly fast.

The only thing negative about the Prius is the fact they retain their value to well making them poor used value.