PCN for not using blue bags correctly?!

almillar

Thanks loksie

[FONT=Helvetica 55 Roman,Helvetica 55 Roman][FONT=Helvetica 55 Roman,Helvetica 55 Roman] and needs to park at the place where you are being collected or dropped. [/FONT][/FONT]

So - define 'at'. Right outside on double yellows? down the street at a dodgy car park, or the slightly further away, slightly safer car park, at the driver's discretion?
Nothing here has shown me that the car was being used for anyone's benefit apart from the badge holder's.

dannyrst

almillar wrote: »

Thanks loksie
So - define 'at'. Right outside on double yellows? down the street at a dodgy car park, or the slightly further away, slightly safer car park, at the driver's discretion?
Nothing here has shown me that the car was being used for anyone's benefit apart from the badge holder's.

Example 1:

Disabled person is driven into town, dropped off outside the shops. Driver goes a mile down the road and parks in a disabled spot with blue badge showing. Walks to meet disabled person.

Example 2:

Old person is driven into town, dropped off outside the shops. Driver goes a mile down the road and finds all spaces taken but can see a disabled space. Doesn't use that space as a disabled person may need it. Carries on for 10 minutes to find a space and parks. Walks to meet old person.

Why can't driver 1 act like driver 2?

cajef

almillar wrote: »

By my reading, that's exactly what it was used for. Leave gran off, go park the car.

But the person parking the car is not the disabled person, they can park to let the disabled person out using the badge then go and find somewhere to park as any other person would have to without using the badge as they are not disabled then they can come back and use the badge to pick the disabled person up, using the badge to park when the disabled person is not with them is an abuse of the badge and could lead to it being withdrawn.


Also from the Booklet for use of the blue badge:-

It is a criminal offence to misuse a badge. This includes people other than the badge holder taking advantage of the parking concessions provided under the scheme.

bazster

I suggest you take yourself off to the PePiPoo council tickets forum: http://forums.pepipoo.com/index.php?showforum=30

They will simply help you (so long as you give them enough information, they can get a bit shirty if they only get half of the picture). They will not sit in smug judgement over you.

abda

That's fine, I get everyone's opinion is based on their own views.
Not taking it as a personal attack at all.
Found out from my Aunt today that the council had actually called my grans house asking to speak to her on the day they issued the ticket but she told them that she wasn't in but wAsnt sure what she was up to as we didn't leave a note at home saying we'd gone.
Just feel like this is a bit extreme, and more importantly don't want my gran being upset by this, which is why I'll appeal but if rejected won't go any further as she's only just got back on her feet after a bad couple of years.
Don't want to give her cause for needless worry!

Altarf

cajef wrote: »

But the person parking the car is not the disabled person, they can park to let the disabled person out using the badge then go and find somewhere to park as any other person would have to without using the badge as they are not disabled then they can come back and use the badge to pick the disabled person up, using the badge to park when the disabled person is not with them is an abuse of the badge and could lead to it being withdrawn.

Try actually reading the conditions -

"The badge is for your use and benefit only. It must only be displayed if you are travelling in the vehicle as a driver or passenger, or if someone is collecting you or dropping you off and needs to park at the place where you are being collected or dropped."

The phrasing of the conditions is quite specific in relation to dropping someone off -

1. "It must only be displayed if you are travelling in the vehicle as a driver or passenger"

OR

2. "if someone is ... dropping you off and needs to park at the place where you are being ... dropped".


The second part is redundant in relation to dropping off if you parked immediately where the blue badge holder was dropped off, because at that moment they are a passenger. It is needed to cover the situation of the blue badge holder being dropped off, and the car then being parked nearby because the drop off spot is not suitable to park. If it meant what you think it means, it would only need to say "or if someone is collecting you and needs to park at the place where you are being collected" and not mention dropping someone off.

It doesn't, so you are wrong.

Anyway, if you think that I will -

• Park somewhere that causes inconvenience, but is immediately outside where my elderly (blue badge holding) mum needs to be; or
• make her walk a few hundred yards down the street from the more sensible parking place; or
• make her wait at the side of the road in February whilst I take 30 minutes to get to the car park and back.

Then you can think again.

cajef

Altarf wrote: »

Try actually reading the conditions -

It doesn't, so you are wrong.
Then you can think again.

or if someone is collecting you or dropping you off and needs to park at the place where you are being collected or dropped."

You forgot to highlight this bit

If you interpret the rules differently that is your choice but don't accuse me of being wrong, as a blue badge holder that has checked the terms of use with the local authority when the badge was issued I am very aware of the conditions and make sure I do not abuse them.

George_Michael

cajef wrote: »

You forgot to highlight this bit

If you interpret the rules differently that is your choice but don't accuse me of being wrong, as a blue badge holder that has checked the terms of use with the local authority when the badge was issued I am very aware of the conditions and make sure I do not abuse them.

That's why I asked the OP what the distance was from dropping off their gran to where they actually parked and what they did once they had parked up.
If it was only a short distance then fair enough, but if it was a mile or two and after parking the car they went shopping or did something else on their own, my opinion is that it would be misuse of the blue badge.

Altarf

cajef wrote: »

You forgot to highlight this bit

But you forgot to actually read it.

Let us go through it one more time shall we to see if you can actually understand what it says -

"The badge is for your use and benefit only. It must only be displayed if you are travelling in the vehicle as a driver or passenger, or if someone is collecting you or dropping you off and needs to park at the place where you are being collected or dropped."

The "or" in the statement is setting out two options

"It must only be displayed if you are travelling in the vehicle as a driver or passenger"

Quite straightforward, and your assertion that is what is required.

However the "or" makes all the difference and permits the use if

"if someone is collecting you or dropping you off and needs to park at the place where you are being collected or dropped."

Collecting and dropping off are two different acts, so the badge permits use

"if someone is collecting you and needs to park at the place where you are being collected "

and also

"if someone is dropping you off and needs to park at the place where you are being dropped"

But hang on a second, if you are right and the car cannot be parked with the blue badge anywhere other than the exact spot where the blue badge holder got out, then what is the point of the "dropping off" part of the statement, as that is covered by the "travelling in the vehicle" part of the statement.

If you were correct, the conditions for use would not need the "dropping off" part of the statement and would read -

"The badge is for your use and benefit only. It must only be displayed if you are travelling in the vehicle as a driver or passenger, or if someone is collecting you and needs to park at the place where you are being collected."

It doesn't, so you are wrong.

cajef wrote: »

If you interpret the rules differently that is your choice but don't accuse me of being wrong, as a blue badge holder that has checked the terms of use with the local authority when the badge was issued I am very aware of the conditions and make sure I do not abuse them.

I am not accusing you of being wrong, I am telling you that you are wrong.

Use of the badge according to the conditions that are actually written, rather than what you think is written, is not abuse.

prowla

Hmm, this is an interesting one.

As I read it, the blue badge applies if you are in the car park of (or nearest to) the place you are taking the disabled person to.

However, it you drop them off at the door and then drive off elsewhere to park, you are no longer using the car to deliver the disabled person and may no longer use the blue badge.

It would apply though if you went somewhere to collect them, parked up and then brought them out to the car.