Vendor illegally entered property after completion?

AdrianC

moneyistooshorttomention wrote: »

The general consensus seems to be there is no way he will get his possessions back again.

They were never his possessions. They were the vendor's possessions which got left, weren't on the inventory, and the OP wasn't particularly enamoured of anyway.

Hoploz

Consider from the seller's perspective...

Takes van of stuff to new house in the morning after trying really hard for the last three hours to squeeze it all in. Can't quite fit everything in, I'll have to do a second trip for them.

Arrives back at old house after stopping for a spot of lunch, a couple of hours later.

No sign of the new people, they don't seem to be here, nobody about. That's lucky, they haven't arrived yet, I'll just grab these few bits and be on my way. I must remember to drop this other set of keys into the estate agent first thing Monday morning.

OP said the stuff was there Friday morning after technical completion, then he didn't go back until Sunday, so how does he know when they came back? It could have been right after he left, on the same day of completion.

kinger101

chanz4 wrote: »

Disagree, and in my previous job I was a CPS professional witness

That is no sort of legal qualification at all. Burden of proof is probably something you'd learn on day 1 of a GCSE law course. I'm sorry, but you are wrong.

Here's a section from Wikipedia, describing the burden of proof in all UK jurisdictions;

The Criminal standard was formerly described as "beyond reasonable doubt". That standard remains, and the words commonly used, though the Judicial Studies Board guidance is that juries might be assisted by being told that to convict they must be persuaded "so that you are sure".

The Civil standard is 'the balance of probabilities', often referred to in judgments as "more likely than not".

It's for this reason that HMRC will often prosecute tax evasion cases in the civil court rather than criminal courts.

DandelionPatrol

chanz4 wrote: »

Disagree, and in my previous job I was a CPS professional witness

That's not something I would boast about....

In other posts

Judas wrote:

I got 30 pieces of silver

Daerve

Breaking and entering!!! Argh, we'll be reading people their rights and pressing charges soon. THIS IS NOT AMERICA.

It's a civil offence of trespass, there's no theft, no burglary and the police won't want to know because it's nothing to do with them.

OP, if you've suffered a loss because of the trespass, phone a solicitor and prepare to dig deep if you want to pursue it, otherwise change the locks.

moneyistooshorttomention

We don't know what OP (or someone close to them) might have suffered within their own homes - hence making them very protective of the security of their homes.

Some of us have suffered "something we shouldn't" one way or another in our own homes - and it does tend to result in becoming VERY protective of the security of them and very conscious there aren't to be any intruders into them.

CLAPTON

moneyistooshorttomention wrote: »

We don't know what OP (or someone close to them) might have suffered within their own homes - hence making them very protective of the security of their homes.

Some of us have suffered "something we shouldn't" one way or another in our own homes - and it does tend to result in becoming VERY protective of the security of them and very conscious there aren't to be any intruders into them.

so what?
except maybe in that case one would change the locks immediately and secure all windows etc

Mallotum_X

icantbelieveitsnotbutter wrote: »

Hi
Thanks for your replies so far...

In response to a few points raised:

- I can't prove who did it, bit I didn't go to the property alone, so have a greater argument that the items existed
- I don't really want someone's old furniture, but theft is theft and;
- Most importantly intrusion is intrusion, and is illegal.

Incidentally the vendor was a 'so and so' for various reasons, and perhaps I should have known better, but hindsight is wonderful thing as we all know.

The outcome I'd like, personally, is whatever legal action can be taken for the intrusion because however trivial it's just not right, and compensation for the stolen items - not for the money, but the principle of it, I'll give any compensation to charity...

I can't believe the audacity of some people, and they get away with it, the problem never goes away...

This isn't theft. The items remained the property of the vendor.

Trespass, but why add to the stress of a new home. Change the locks

JencParker

moneyistooshorttomention wrote: »

We don't know what OP (or someone close to them) might have suffered within their own homes - hence making them very protective of the security of their homes.

Some of us have suffered "something we shouldn't" one way or another in our own homes - and it does tend to result in becoming VERY protective of the security of them and very conscious there aren't to be any intruders into them.

The OP has every right to feel angry at the intrusion that is entirely understandable. However, the idea that they could somehow make the vendor 'pay' legally for such a error of judgement cannot be taken seriously. Yes, vent on a public forum, yes, tell their solicitor to send a letter of 'displeasure' to the vendor, but anything more than that is out of proportion to what has happened.

SnooksNJ

Daerve wrote: »

Breaking and entering!!! Argh, we'll be reading people their rights and pressing charges soon. THIS IS NOT AMERICA.

It's a civil offence of trespass, there's no theft, no burglary and the police won't want to know because it's nothing to do with them.

OP, if you've suffered a loss because of the trespass, phone a solicitor and prepare to dig deep if you want to pursue it, otherwise change the locks.

The American attitude would be great I don't have to bring this crappy old furniture to the curb.
Or be totally passive aggressive and ask the Seller is there a history of break in's because they had one Friday night.