holiday fines

TBagpuss

so you are saying that it is OK for the parents of *healthy* kids to get cheaper holidays but not for those whose children have been unwell?

I think the problem is that attendance doesn't necessarily mean that a child is going to do well or can afford to miss time off. And it becomes very difficult policitally to say, in effect, that it is OK for academically able kids to be taken on holiday and not for the less able ones.

Linking it to attendance is easier to police but potentially penalises families whose children miss school for medical reasons or family emergencies (which then potential has a knock on effect of parents sending children in inappropriately when they are unwell). It also arguably sends a message that you only really need to be in school for (say) 37 instead of 39 weeks each year and that you can 'use' the extra 14 days either for illness or for holidays.

It's hard for teachers to manage gaps in kids education, and expecting them to set, and mark work for children when they are away puts an extra burden on the teachers, and also may not work, as if the children don';t do the work, or their parents are not able to explain the concepts or factors covered then they will need to review it with their teacher at a a later stage.

It might wok better if you gave discretion back to schools, and based the giving on permission on the child's performance - e.g. that to get permission you have to be at least reaching the targets set for you. Because the issue is about trying to ensure that the child still gets an adequate education, and that they can fairly easily catch up on what is missed.

One option might be to make permission conditional on the child being enrolled in a private summer/holiday school for the same length of time as the time missed, so that no extra work falls on the schools and parents can chose to pay for a tutor to cover all missed work. But no doubt parents would then resent being expected to pay for that.

Gra76

TBagpuss wrote: »

so you are saying that it is OK for the parents of *healthy* kids to get cheaper holidays but not for those whose children have been unwell?

Dear god, you're not my wife posting are you? She has a habit of twisting what I say as well... /facepalm

The odd day of sickness isn't going to impact much on attendance, and any extended sickness would surely go as authorised absences on the report provided it was backed up by a doctors note?

I can't believe I really have to spell it out, but parents who let their kids skive off or keep them at home for the hell of it are the ones who should be fined, not the ones who's kids have high attendance OR have authorised absence due to illness.

Anyone else want to put words in my mouth or post things things I haven't said that you want to make out that I've said? I'm sure it could be twisted further... lol

Gloomendoom

Presumably, if the children are going on holidays rather than attending school, their attendance record will not be good, particularly if they do it every year.

onlyroz

meritaten wrote: »

its sad how little respect education authorities have for 'family time'. a holiday away can teach kids so much - isn't that why schools organise 'trips' for the kids? but if parents do it..............that's NOT allowed.

Surely they can have this family time in the 12-13 weeks of the year that the children are not at school?

onlyroz

meer53 wrote: »

The petition should be about getting holiday companies to stop ripping families off during school holidays.

How do you suggest they do that? I suggest you look up "supply and demand". Perhaps you think that people who holiday during off-peak periods should subsidise those who holiday at peak times? Or perhaps you are suggesting that the government imposes a "holiday tax" - perhaps by adding a few percent onto income tax so that we can all enjoy a cheap week in the sun at the cost of the tax payer?

onlyroz

Gra76 wrote: »

I can't justify paying the price to take 5 of us away in the school holidays. I can live with £3k for a decent all-inclusive for us out of term time but can't swallow the significant increase during school holidays, it's just not feasible. The same holiday is likely to cost close to double the price once the school holidays start.

If you can't afford it then quite simply you shouldn't go. If you can afford £3k a year for your holiday then you could have a marvellous UK break in August, which is more than many people can afford.

My parents and my in-laws never went abroad during the summer because it just wasn't affordable. So instead they rented caravans or stayed in tents in the UK, still giving them that precious "family time" without breaking the bank.

Since when did a holiday abroad each year become a human right?

Gra76

onlyroz wrote: »

If you can't afford it then quite simply you shouldn't go. If you can afford £3k a year for your holiday then you could have a marvellous UK break in August, which is more than many people can afford.

My parents and my in-laws never went abroad during the summer because it just wasn't affordable. So instead they rented caravans or stayed in tents in the UK, still giving them that precious "family time" without breaking the bank.

Since when did a holiday abroad each year become a human right?

We don't holiday abroad most years, it's too expensive. We've been abroad twice in the last 11 years. We came back from a caravan holiday only 2 weeks ago which was all of a two hour drive from our front door. The £3k refers to next year (which we're currently planning and saving for). Who said anything about holidays abroad being a human right?

Jagraf

Gra76 wrote: »

I've typed and re-typed this half a dozen times to try and find a reasonable argument to support taking my kids out of school in term time but the long and short of it is that it comes down to the money.

I can't justify paying the price to take 5 of us away in the school holidays. I can live with £3k for a decent all-inclusive for us out of term time but can't swallow the significant increase during school holidays, it's just not feasible. The same holiday is likely to cost close to double the price once the school holidays start.

I'm not exactly over the moon about paying the fine, I think it should only be applied to parents who's children have anything other than a perfect or near perfect attendance, however it still makes the holiday affordable even when you add it to the price of the holiday.

Our kids all have 100% attendance other than the occasional annual holiday we take them on and it's doing them no harm at all. Eldest is exceeding his targets by a fair distance as usual and the middle one is exceeding targets set for kids in the year above. Youngest is only just going up to full-time school now but she's bright as a button as well.

I agree that parents who's children have low attendance and take their kids out of school for a family holiday should be fined but when your kids have high attendance and are doing really well I don't really see the issue.

Then go every two years instead.

It sounds as though education is serving your children well. Why are you not seeing it as top priority, especially when you could go to the UK one year in the school hols, and abroad the next with the recouped money in the school hols.

The point is, kids often do well at school, because they go to school :cool:

Jagraf

Gra76 wrote: »

We don't holiday abroad most years, it's too expensive. We've been abroad twice in the last 11 years. We came back from a caravan holiday only 2 weeks ago which was all of a two hour drive from our front door. The £3k refers to next year (which we're currently planning and saving for). Who said anything about holidays abroad being a human right?

I took my family camping for £8 a night. I don't think its that much cheaper during school time.

Jagraf

Why does family time equate to going somewhere else? You can have family time at home and day trips etc.

Some of my best family time memories were the cheaper ones.

There is no excuse. Basically its parents wanting cheap holidays abroad which they consider more important than their children's education.

Family time can be done anywhere, cheaply. Or for nothing.
Experiences can also be done cheaply, or for nothing, or of it is something amazing, do it every few years in the holiday.