Britain is living through the best time ever

Graham_Devon

lessonlearned wrote: »

House was £93.5k, the original capital sum borrowed around £71k if memories serves. Now around £68. The deposit came from the Bank of Mum.........

Right - and now were at the nub of the issue.

You were telling others he did it on his own two feet, that others should do the same.

I would like to state here that I'm not saying what you did was wrong, it's a very nice thing to do.

However, you can't make out your son is somewhat special in regard to finance and that he stood on his own two feet.

Without YOU and your £20k+, he wouldn't have that house and would be like so many others paying that private rent you state is unaffordable.

So don't be too quick to judge or make out others have the same opportunities - that's all I'm saying.

As for "not overextending himself" he seems to have done just that. A mortgage rate of 8% will see over half of his income going on the mortgage alone. (it's would be the equivalent cost of private rent which you stated he would not be able to afford). He may never see a mortgage rate of 8%. But most homeowners will or have done over a 25 year period.

lessonlearned

JencParker wrote: »

In order to do that you must have been in either a privileged financial position or had help from the state.

Are you kidding......

I had to sell my house and anything of value in order to survive.

Now I suppose you will argue that I was "privileged" to own a house in the first place.

But then if you call leaving school at 15 and working hard all my life, buying wrecks and fixing them up, bringing up a family and then caring for my disabled husband for 9 years then yes you are right.

I was indeed privileged in that I was lucky enough to be able to work hard all my life, and use my wits and intelligence in order to build up sufficient assets to sell.

lessonlearned

Graham_Devon wrote: »

Right - and now were at the nub of the issue.

You were telling others he did it on his own two feet, that others should do the same.

I would like to state here that I'm not saying what you did was wrong, it's a very nice thing to do.

However, you can't make out your son is somewhat special in regard to finance and that he stood on his own two feet.

Without YOU and your £20k+, he wouldn't have that house and would be like so many others paying that private rent you state is unaffordable.

So don't be too quick to judge or make out others have the same opportunities - that's all I'm saying.

As for "not overextending himself" he seems to have done just that. A mortgage rate of 8% will see over half of his income going on the mortgage alone.

It is not beyond the bounds of reason that mortgage rates could hit 8 per cent. We will cross that bridge when we come to it. A lodger perhaps.......

I am sorry But I'd don't understand what you are driving at.

I discussed my sons position only in relation to mortgage payments versus rent. I did not at any time talk about deposits.

It was merely to illustrate that often mortgage payment costs less than rent and that many people can afford a mortgage if only they could scrape up a deposit.

What I'd did say was that the stumbling block for many was raising that deposit and that in those cases then RTB might be the answer for those who were finding it difficult to save for initial deposit.

I am definitely not judging others - it's very tough out there and niot just for the young trying to get started.

But we have veered off topic. I just happen to think that the UK is still a pretty good place to live and that it saddens me to see so many people who don't seem to appreciate how blessed we Brits really are.

Just my opinion but I think the UK is fab.......

Graham_Devon

lessonlearned wrote: »

Just my opinion but I think the UK is fab.......

The UK is brilliant in many many ways. The NHS, democracy, the freedom of speech (which goes way beyond many countries), access to a huge amount of services, leisure etc.

Discussing one aspect which doesn't seem to work very well, be it house prices or our dire train infrastructure doesn't mean you hate the UK.

I don't know where this assumption comes from that if you have an issue with one thing it's OK for others to make out you don't like the UK as a whole.

Seems an utterly bizarre way to go about a debate. Afterall, what's the point of this forum? Everything anyone writes can be trumped with "well it's better here than in Syria" etc and "if you don't like it you can emigrate".

As for your son - his mortgage payments are a direct result of your deposit. He would not be able to afford the mortgage without you and would not have had the house. Therefore, he's not standing on his own two feet as much as you suggested. I questioned your post initially as it seemed very odd to have such a cheap house (I thought he had bought years ago at lower price initially which is what I was going to suggest isn't possible today).

The overarching point though was that you made out it could be done on minimum wage - I was simply questioning it, and as it turned out, it couldn't be done on minimum wage (something which you state as you state he could not afford private rent).

kaflinkle

When life knocks you down you have two choices.

Stay down and bewail your fate or drag yourself up and fight back.

This is the most sensible thing on this thread yet.

ukcarper

lessonlearned wrote: »

Are you kidding......

I had to sell my house and anything of value in order to survive.

Now I suppose you will argue that I was "privileged" to own a house in the first place.

But then if you call leaving school at 15 and working hard all my life, buying wrecks and fixing them up, bringing up a family and then caring for my disabled husband for 9 years then yes you are right.

I was indeed privileged in that I was lucky enough to be able to work hard all my life, and use my wits and intelligence in order to build up sufficient assets to sell.

Doesn't your last sentence say it all I was bought up in substandard housing because my parents couldn't get a council house and most of my friends lived on the council estates. But my parents and my friends parents were working and gave us the support and encouragement we needed. But many of today's children and their parents do/did not have that and they are starting from a very disadvantaged position and that is what needs to be addressed.

Back in the 80s I was fishing on the canal in east London their were some flats on the other bank with a young boy playing in the car park a woman who I assume was his mother leant over a second floor balcony a shouted Joe(can't remember real name) (excuse my language) !!!!ing get up here you little !!!!er I often wonder what happened to that little boy but what chance did he have compared to me. The problem needed to be addressed then it's going to be very difficult now.

lessonlearned

graham - further to add.....

I did nit say he did it all on his own - standing on his own two,feet.

What I did say that he was NOW able to stand in his own two feet. He can do this because (currently) his mietgage payments are more affordable than rent........

So please don't twist my words.

The point was making is that he could not afford a rent of £550 with take home pay of under £1k, but that he can manage his mortgage.

Thank you for warning about future affordability should interest rates rise. We are monitoring this.

His current deal expires in December and we are looking to start a 5 year fix whilst rates are still low. That should be enough to ensure that his mortgage remains affordable. If not then he will have to take in a lodger.

In the meantime he is also looking at ways to increase his income....

You asked me how he did it. I gave you a break down of costs and some background info on property prices in our area to put things into context.

Actually I'm nit blind, I am well aware that the UK is not perfect, the NHS is struggling, our infrastructure is crumbling in parts etc etc

But surely I can still be proud of my country or isn't that allowed any more.

My little "I think the UK is fab" is just my pathetic attempt at lightening the mood a little........and was not meant to be a definitive "state of the nation" speech. It would appear that my levity is not acceptable on here.

I will now withdraw and leave you to your deliberations. The sun is shining and I'm itching to get out into the garden.

Graham_Devon

ukcarper wrote: »

Doesn't your last sentence say it all I was bought up in substandard housing because my parents couldn't get a council house and most of my friends lived on the council estates. But my parents and my friends parents were working and gave us the support and encouragement we needed. But many of today's children and their parents do/did not have that and they are starting from a very disadvantaged position and that is what needs to be addressed.

Back in the 80s I was fishing on the canal in east London their were some flats on the other bank with a young boy playing in the car park a woman who I assume was his mother leant over a second floor balcony a shouted Joe(can't remember real name) (excuse my language) !!!!ing get up here you little !!!!er I often wonder what happened to that little boy but what chance did he have compared to me. The problem needed to be addressed then it's going to be very difficult now.

The key issue is that we are all different.

Our lives are, predominantly mapped out at an early age. There are lots of things we can do to change this, however, those changes are often extremely hard. it's often easier to take chances if you have financial backing. I know one person who takes every chance given to him, he's optimistic on everything - but he has never, and will never need to worry about financial income. His income just happens through royalties based on his grandfathers work.

I'm open enough to state I've had chances come my way solely because of who I know or where I have been. Right place, right time and all that.

Would those chances have been the same if my family had stayed at the other end of the country? No, of course not. I may have had better chances 300 miles north or I may have had worse.

I could have done better than I have, of course I could - we all could. But that change would have had lots of costs associated, emotional aswell as financial. I'd have had to forgo relationships and family to benefit financially. Price I'm willing to pay for financial gain? No.

What we know maps out lives. Where you are born, when you are born, who you are born to all has an impact. While one person may get a large deposit from parents, their peer and best mate throughout school may get nothing. They could have had the same opportunities throughout school, but in one instant, one peer overtakes the other through no effort on his part.

We need to stop pretending it's all about working more and seeking out and taking every opportunity and be humble enough to accept a lot of where we all are today is down to choices and situations that we had no part in making.

lessonlearned

UK Carper - I too was brought up in substandard housing.

Spent the first 4 years of my life living in one room with my parents, till they managed to get something better.

As for the little boy I guess you'll never know what happened to him.

But little boys and girls born into such circumstances can sometimes do well in the end, despite their shaky starts.

i am under no,illusion that life is tough for many people, through no fault of their own.

How to cure it..... I have no idea. We justbhave to do what we can with what we've got.

I just happen to think that if I wasand now going to be poor or sick then I would rather be poor and sick here in the UK.

My future DIL comes from Venezuela. Her country is in a shocking state and she worries about her family's safety.

Without getting all preachy I genuinely think things really could be a lot worse and that we are truly blessed here. I really have nothing else useful to add so I shall now take my leave.

missyrichards

Graham_Devon wrote: »

I don't know where this assumption comes from that if you have an issue with one thing it's OK for others to make out you don't like the UK as a whole.

Seems an utterly bizarre way to go about a debate. Afterall, what's the point of this forum? Everything anyone writes can be trumped with "well it's better here than in Syria" etc and "if you don't like it you can emigrate".

I agree.:D

It always seems like there are certain people on here that say they are in a good financial position and say it was because they worked hard and anyone who says that they are not in such a good position must be a lazy scrounger.

Last time I looked the rents around where I live are about £1,300 a month for a 3 bed house. I wouldn't like to be forking out that much money in just rent. I don't think it matters how hard someone works it is still an eye watering amount of money to find every month.

Actually I just checked and a 3 bed can be anywhere from £1,200 to £2,500 a month.:eek: