NHS Weekend Working and Sunday Trading?

ukcarper

Generali wrote: »

Staff costs may increase but you get to offset that against assets being used for 7/7 days rather than 5/7.

My radiotherapists worked a 9 day fortnight as is the norm in the Aussie health system. As a result, the extremely expensive radiography unit sat unused for 5 days out of 14, more than a third of the time.

Staff cost are a large part of the NHS budget, I suppose if just a matter of employing 40% more consultants the cost might not be that big compared to overall cost, finding consultants might be a problem though.

remorseless

marleyboy wrote: »

I guess in that case - so long as Staff are given exceptions. I imagine exceptions would cover religious purposes too.

yup - in Australia when I worked on 24x7, usually Indus were happy to work on Xmas if they could get Diwali off, Christians would work on Diwali, etc!

Depends on the exception - makes me wonder why anyone would want to work in hospital care if they cannot commit the hours/lifestyle!

I would not be surprised if everybody has their 'exception' and can everybody be pleased? I guess it all depends how much they want to stay employed.

Generali

ukcarper wrote: »

Staff cost are a large part of the NHS budget, I suppose if just a matter of employing 40% more consultants the cost might not be that big compared to overall cost, finding consultants might be a problem though.

Would you need 40% more consultants? After all there wouldn't be more sick people to treat, they'd just be treated at different times of the week.

If you treat a sick person on a Saturday or make them wait until Monday it still takes the same amount of medical time and resources to treat them.

Those resources might cost you more money if you decide to compensate them for working on the weekend or at night by paying them more money but you don't need more inputs of anything except cash.

The only problem there is that the NHS costs a sodding fortune as it is.

remorseless

Generali wrote: »

Would you need 40% more consultants? After all there wouldn't be more sick people to treat, they'd just be treated at different times of the week.

and you would hope that in 2015 the NHS would have managed to get statistical information to be able to forecast to the extent possible given the nature of the business! :A

ukcarper

Generali wrote: »

Would you need 40% more consultants? After all there wouldn't be more sick people to treat, they'd just be treated at different times of the week.

If you treat a sick person on a Saturday or make them wait until Monday it still takes the same amount of medical time and resources to treat them.

Those resources might cost you more money if you decide to compensate them for working on the weekend or at night by paying them more money but you don't need more inputs of anything except cash.

The only problem there is that the NHS costs a sodding fortune as it is.

Possibly wouldn't need 40% but if the argument is people are more likely to die at weekend those doctors would be treating those patients and not doing the work they are doing in the week.

I've had a lot to do with the NHS over the last 10 to 20 years and some hospitals already provide services over weekend my wife had an operation late on a Saturday night and recently had a scan early on a Sunday morning.

The thing that amazes me is that the idea for making the NHS more efficient seems to be cutting staff where what is needed is a look at the way they operate. For example in my experience most consultant appointments require you to have blood tests so not much is done on first appointment other than to arrange tests, why not send out blood test forms with apointment letter so test results are available on first appointment. I'm sure there are plenty of other examples where existing resources could be used better.

PasturesNew

The reason many people dislike working evenings/weekends etc is that they can't take part in stuff others go to. e.g. people meeting up at the weekend, or events that occur only on the weekend. They feel they're "missing out".

So 24/7 working will be fine if we ban events and ban people meeting up, having holidays and generally having fun

If you work it leaves little spare time to fit those things in, coordinating with others' limited holiday times and having to use some holiday time for things you're expected to do (eg Xmas at the parents' house and travelling there/back).

While it'd be "great" if you could get what you want when you want it, 24/7, the reality is it'd be another breaking up of social norms, social connections, bonding and a sense of place and belonging if everybody were doing it.

I bet people right now are thinking "what can I/we do at the weekend? who might I like to spend that time with?" The novelty would soon wear off if nobody were ever available as everybody were working different/odd shifts etc.

PasturesNew

I had a friend in a Welsh Hospital, radiographer. She'd do a night shift and some weekends. It was always classed as overtime and her pay was regular pay plus £100 plus a day off in lieu. She was also provided with a room to sleep in as she had a lot of spare time as she was sitting waiting for somebody to break a leg and need an X-Ray.

It was an outrageous cost and waste of money/resources that she was sitting around a lot of the time - chatting online to us friends.

remorseless

interesting! It makes you wonder how people in say Asia manage to function!
Maybe that would be possible when most of operation is carried out by machines, though then we would complain about unemployment.

I would like to live smack on the centre of town, in a townhouse possibly, 40 hours a week and holidays abroad, better flying 1st class, etc

Maybe it'll get to a point where people will have to choose between being employed or enjoying the benefit of wondering what to do on a spare day if they have the money to spend!

elantan

lostinrates wrote: »

NHs ( and some other professions) isn't just about economics though. Not much fun socialising if your friend is admitted to hospital at one of the times they are statistically less likely to survive because of staffing issues. Then, if we expect these people to work they deserve services available to them. I think that's why times like the two 'sacrosanct' bank holidays we have are still not great for those who get I'll, but precious socially/ family wise. A day like that a quarter, or every two months might be a medium measure? Some people, whether we like it or not will fall between cracks, but as it stands the system creaks and its inflexibility with those in work is not practical.

It isnt justabout economics, but the staff are not paid great to begin with ( some are admittedly) and the workers are having to take time away from their families, say one partner only works mon-fri but their partner has to work three weekends out of four for the NHS ( for example) so they dont have much time together, should they not be compensated for that? or should they be given the option? just now for many ( again using the NHS example) they have no choice but HAVE to work so they have to sacrifice through no choice their only family time. Have they only to have this "sacrosanct" time every other month?

elantan

PasturesNew wrote: »

I had a friend in a Welsh Hospital, radiographer. She'd do a night shift and some weekends. It was always classed as overtime and her pay was regular pay plus £100 plus a day off in lieu. She was also provided with a room to sleep in as she had a lot of spare time as she was sitting waiting for somebody to break a leg and need an X-Ray.

It was an outrageous cost and waste of money/resources that she was sitting around a lot of the time - chatting online to us friends.

I know nurses that have a very different experience from that, working xmas day they dont get any extra days off, just the basic Sunday hours pay, and they have to work hard 24/7 it doesnt slow down on xmas day, people are still ill