Motorway Speed limits?? (in red lit circles)- are these strict to camera fines ??

Meganjones

On the motorway (M1)

if them black electronic boards on the motorway (which you drive underneath) and they have messages, such as Slow Down, or Que ahead etc.
(written in orange lights)


Well when they have a speed limit in a red circle
(which is a red circle, that is in red lights) of 40mph,

such as this:





Then are these speed limits in the red circles more strict to speeding/camera fines? (if you drive slightly faster than that speed limit, and there are cameras, then can they catch you)


ie, are these speed limits more prone to capturing people who go over the limit, (compared to the ones which are not in red light circles)

are these red light circle speed limits more strict ? (from the point of capturing people on camera who go faster that that written limit?)

Thank you

bazster

It's much simpler than that. The speed limits in the photo you posted are legally enforceable. The other kind (the yellow ones without the red circle) are purely advisory and are not enforceable.

brat

If they are red circled, they are legally enforceable. If they don't, they are not, merely advisory.

bod1467

^^^ is the correct answer.

IamNotAllowedToUseMyName

What you are referring to is known as the ACPO guidelines for speed enforcement which suggest that generally speeding is only enforced at 10% + 2 mph, so at 50mph speed limit they will only enforce at 57mph.

The reason for this is to make sure that there is no room for argument - for two reasons, ensuring that motorists do not feel too aggrieved at being caught, and secondly it is a large enough gap that they don't have to go through any rigmarole in court about the accuracy of equipment.

Also, your speedo is certainly not accurate and is likely to over-read by a small number of mph, so when you see your speedo saying 70 you may only be doing 67 - so many people who believe they are driving around at 80 and have never been caught may well only be driving at 75 - within ACPO guidelines - and are not going to be pulled over.

Motorway speed cameras have the same principle applied whether they are gantry cameras enforcing variable limits, or average speed cameras working through roadworks.

However, you should not rely on the ACPO guidelines. If you go to court denying you were doing 57 in a 50 and the Magistrates ask how fast you were going and you answered "51mph because I checked on my SatNav" the magistrates would be obliged to convict you as speeding is an absolute offence. Also, do not drive past a marked police car at more than the limit plus what ever margin you believe applies for your inaccurate speedo, because on a bad day the police may just decide you are taking the Mickey for passing them at 77mph and pull you over anyway. It the police are cruising at the limit, they are typically making a statement of the acceptable speed, they generally do not cruise at that speed because of the confusion it causes, they will normally drive well below the limit to avoid log jams.

DUTR

IanMSpencer wrote: »

(agreed comments snipped)

It the police are cruising at the limit, they are typically making a statement of the acceptable speed, they generally do not cruise at that speed because of the confusion it causes, they will normally drive well below the limit to avoid log jams.

I have not seen it for many years (rolling road blocks excepted) I do remember going along the M5 and there was a queue of traffic in lane 1, cruised along in lane 2 and at the front was a Police car and others just decided to queue behind them.

But yes, the OP is not high enough up the food chain to believe they are immune from those speed signs, worst bit is there are often several signs showing the speed before the ones with the cameras on the gantry.

alleycat`

The ones on the M62 "smart motorway" section appear not to be following ACPO guidelines?

The last stats i saw for the money they'd made in 2015 showed that 30% of those captured in the 50mph enforcement were HGV.

The restriction of 56mph on such vehicles would suggest that they couldn't be getting caught (and certainly not in such high numbers) if ACPO guidelines were used.

BeenThroughItAll

alleycat` wrote: »

The ones on the M62 "smart motorway" section appear not to be following ACPO guidelines?

The last stats i saw for the money they'd made in 2015 showed that 30% of those captured in the 50mph enforcement were HGV.

The restriction of 56mph on such vehicles would suggest that they couldn't be getting caught (and certainly not in such high numbers) if ACPO guidelines were used.

That's why they're called 'guidelines' and not 'The Law'. No-one has to follow them.


If you're doing 51MPH in a 50MPH limit, you're breaking the law, and you can be prosecuted. Doesn't mean you will be, but you still can.

Marktheshark

The Guidelines are "guidlines".
The M62 ones have indeed caught thousands of HGV drivers and they will nail you at anything above 53 mph at 50 and 64 at 60mph.

There is an article in one the papers if anyone can find it with HGV drivers complaining the guidelines are been ignored

alleycat`

BeenThroughItAll wrote: »

That's why they're called 'guidelines' and not 'The Law'. No-one has to follow them.


If you're doing 51MPH in a 50MPH limit, you're breaking the law, and you can be prosecuted. Doesn't mean you will be, but you still can.

I agree. Speeding is an absolute offense.

I was refering to one of the posts above which said you'd be ok up to 57mph (following acpo guidelines).

Based on local knowledge of the M62 and recent prosecutions this is not true. I suspect it might apply to the M1 corridor where they intersect also.

Marktheshark

I can not find the article online but I read it in print, might have been the Huddersfield examiner.
However they replied that ACPO were police guidlines and the cameras were not operated by the police, they are operated by the highways agency.
It just fell to the police to pursue the offence and speeding is speeding.