Civil ceremony in a Chapel/Church?

itsanne

tea_lover wrote: »

Really? That's a genuine question BTW. I wouldn't count a few capitals and the word 'rude' as outrage. Maybe I've just seen more in life to get genuinely upset about than someone else's caps lock.

Really ....... but I suspect you're taking the word rather more strongly than I am.

Tea lover, I seem to have hit a raw nerve. That was truly not my intention. I'll bow out of this now.

onlyroz

seashore22 wrote: »

Oh and a building (and that is what a church is) is hardly going to convert any non believers either. Generally speaking it's words and actions that convert people, not the opportunity to gawp at the oh so lovely stained glass and the dinky little church pews.

So why are churches happy to conduct marriage ceremonies for people who have never previously attended church then? Not because they are desperate for more bums-on-seats and a bit of extra cash?

thorsoak

Here are the legal aspects of getting married in a church in the UK :-

http://www.yourchurchwedding.org/youre-welcome/legal-aspects-of-marriage.aspx

missbiggles1

onlyroz wrote: »

So it seems like you can't have a civil marriage conducted in a
church but you can have a civil partnership.

As for why somebody might want to do this, there are a few reasons. You might just want a wedding in a pretty building, but you're unwilling to lie about your faith to do this. Or perhaps you want to placate religious members of your family (my mum did this with my grandma's funeral - she conducted a broadly humanist ceremony but got a preacher friend to say a few prayers at the end to please the Christian members of the family).

In any case, in the current climate of dwindling church attendance I would have thought that ministers would be keen to encourage non-believers to visit their amazing special buildings. An atheist or agnostic might only visit a church a handful of times in their life, and so the opportunities for converting them are slim-on-the-ground. Why not open up these buildings to non-believers, in the hope that they might be inspired to become a believer? It seems highly counterproductive to ban these people from your church if you hope to win them over to your faith.

Many churches are open most of the time for people who want to look around and I'm sure most non believers have visited churches many times as tourists.

You're hardly going to "win people over" to your faith if they see you showing it such little respect.

Jagraf

onlyroz wrote: »

So why are churches happy to conduct marriage ceremonies for people who have never previously attended church then? Not because they are desperate for more bums-on-seats and a bit of extra cash?

Because there are a set of house rules. By agreeing to a religious ceremony you are agreeing to the terms of the church's business.

As far as bums on seats are concerned, maybe you have a point, but that's like any other environment (theme parks don't want you to have a good time, they just want your money). However, you wouldn't go in to a pub and demand that the pub sells Stella, when they only sell kronenburg.

Their rules, their house, their business. It's not up to Jo public to tell them how to run their business, even if they think they have a right. An especially if they think they are doing the church a favour by showing up for one day and paying peanuts compared to the reception.

And I don't actually think its good for religion, either.

seashore22

onlyroz wrote: »

So why are churches happy to conduct marriage ceremonies for people who have never previously attended church then? Not because they are desperate for more bums-on-seats and a bit of extra cash?

Because they have an obligation to marry anyone from the Parish, be they believers or unbelievers. They also accept couples from outside the Parish for various reasons, but they have to satisfy certain criteria.

Of course the money comes in handy because old pretty churches are a complete money pit. But they don't sell their souls by taking money from just anyone. Lots of churches make judgements about who can rent their buildings and some groups wouldn't be acceptable.

In any case if previous posters are correct, churches are banned from performing civil ceremonies, so it's not in their remit to decide one way or another.

onlyroz

Jagraf wrote: »

Their rules, their house, their business. It's not up to Jo public to tell them how to run their business, even if they think they have a right.

I don't think anybody's disputing that. And, this is a purely hypothetical discussion. However, churches are certainly run like businesses these days (if the investment portfolio of the CofE is anything to go by) and every business needs to do their best to attract new customers if they are to survive.

Georgiegirl256

onlyroz wrote: »

In any case, in the current climate of dwindling church attendance I would have thought that ministers would be keen to encourage non-believers to visit their amazing special buildings. An atheist or agnostic might only visit a church a handful of times in their life, and so the opportunities for converting them are slim-on-the-ground. Why not open up these buildings to non-believers, in the hope that they might be inspired to become a believer? It seems highly counterproductive to ban these people from your church if you hope to win them over to your faith.

I can see how that mightwork for non believers who are having a religious ceremony (which obviously at the moment that's the only choice they have in a church) because they are standing there and saying their vows 'in the eyes of the lord', and in a lot of churches you have to go for a few weeks before hand anyhow.

But for someone for whatever reason wanting a civil ceremony I really cannot see that happening. If you were thinking of joining the church, then why not have a religious ceremony in the first place? Why would you want a civil ceremony.

In a place where you are surrounded by religious artifacts (not sure what the correct terminology sorry ) do people not find it to be disrespectful to ask them to remove all mentions of religion and god from the service?

seashore22

I'm failing to understand why you don't understand why it's not possible.

That was to onlyroz by the way.

Jagraf

onlyroz wrote: »

I don't think anybody's disputing that. And, this is a purely hypothetical discussion. However, churches are certainly run like businesses these days (if the investment portfolio of the CofE is anything to go by) and every business needs to do their best to attract new customers if they are to survive.

I agree. But there are many avenues to pursue before taking on people who categorically disagree with their reason for being. That's just detrimental to any organisation.