When did this change?

Rosemary7391

LameWolf wrote: »

Your words ring true with me; I have the same problem with meat (even the smell makes me heave):(

I am in my mid-50s now, and have never, ever had people over for dinner - I just know I would be expected to provide meat, and I have no idea how to cook it - and if I knew I wouldn't be able to actually do it.

LOL I remember when I was in my mid 20s and had by then long since escaped my mother's attempts to force-feed me with meat (like your milk, it invariably returned the way it went down) - I was over at my parents for the obligatory Boxing Day meal and my mother's comment was "Well can't you just have a couple of slices of turkey, because it's Christmas?" :wall::wall::wall:

I wouldn't expect to be given meat if invited to a vegetarian's house for dinner. Why would they cook something they wouldn't eat themselves? I'd rather have something tasty they knew how to cook really well then again I'm really not fussy!

I'd certainly cater for vegetarian and food allergies/intolerances and have done in the past. I enjoy cooking so think it's quite fun finding ways around it! My favorite is lasagne: I've a 3 hole lasagne pan so it's really easy to do a normal, veggie and dairy free one. I've never had more than one or two different requests at a time though. If I'm aware of something that someone just dislikes I'll try but the problem with asking is if everyone invited has conflicting likes/dislikes, what do you do?

honeythewitch

moneyistooshorttomention wrote: »

I would be interested to pinpoint what year (or thereabouts) that incident happened. I fully understand where you are coming from on that and have experienced similar incidents...but there came a point in history where someone would have had to be pretty "obtuse" not to cater for things like that (there are still some about unfortunately:().

I can relate to being "told off" for having specialist requirements - as if it were my fault - and hence feel pretty strongly about "It is what it is - and the host caters for whatever the guest says needs to be catered for" and doesn't question it/condemn it. I haven't really made up my mind personally re the whole gluten-free/diary-free/whatever-free thing personally - but, if I'm told not to provide whatever type of food it is - then I'm not going to go into the "why and wherefores". I will just cater accordingly.

I know exactly when it was because we had just moved house!
It was either January or February 1970, and at nine I was old enough to know not to ask the contents of sandwiches so the ticking off was justified.

My family was not at all strict, and we were allowed to eat what we liked and leave what we liked at mealtimes, but we were expected to have perfect manners when we were out (and mostly we did)

moneyistooshorttomention

Rosemary7391 wrote: »

If I'm aware of something that someone just dislikes I'll try but the problem with asking is if everyone invited has conflicting likes/dislikes, what do you do?

When I've had that situation before then its been a "buffet" type meal with various help-yourself type dishes and chosen so that I knew everyone could eat most of the things on the table. So Person A could eat 4 or 5 things they would be okay with, Person B could substitute anything they couldn't have for something else and I could eat absolutely everything on the table. That seemed to work.

On one occasion of a light lunch it was a soup I knew everyone could eat, a couple of different types of bread, a couple of different things to spread on the bread, grated cheddar cheese to put on the soup separately and chunks of goats cheese (as I recall - the main thing I was concerned with at that meal was someone who couldn't have cows milk, but was okay with goats milk).

For pudding - then that could be a made-up pudding on the one hand and choice of fresh fruit (to include something a bit more "luxury" on the other hand) and those who couldn't have a pudding ingredient would take some fruit instead.

I've noticed that its starting to become commonplace at "bring and share" meals for people to put a little label with the food they put on the table listing the ingredients in it. That way its up to anyone hoping to have a bit of it to read off the ingredients to see if there are any they don't eat. I must say I think that's a good idea. I've certainly found it awkward in the past to see a buffet of food laid out and sometimes its not been obvious what I could (or couldn't) eat and I've had to resort to picking up a sample sandwich, putting it on my plate and lifting the "lid" to see if I could have it and then just throwing it away uneaten more often than not (because I'd seen, on closer inspection, that I couldn't have it).

It's then sometimes a pleasant surprise to find I can have a portion of cake or pudding after all - when I just assume they will all have sugar in and so don't take any (but a read of the label has sometimes revealed they've used something healthy to sweeten it instead - so I can have some after all).

Just remembered the former work colleague who brought in some pastry item or other for us all to eat at work one time and I bit into it in all innocence and then asked why the pastry tasted different to normal - she'd made it with some lard in it. She seemed to think I was in the wrong for throwing the rest of mine away...but it had honestly never occurred to me that anyone still did that.

LameWolf

moneyistooshorttomention wrote: »

Just remembered the former work colleague who brought in some pastry item or other for us all to eat at work one time and I bit into it in all innocence and then asked why the pastry tasted different to normal - she'd made it with some lard in it. She seemed to think I was in the wrong for throwing the rest of mine away...but it had honestly never occurred to me that anyone still did that.

I actually loathe cooking, and only do it because I have to - but when Mr LW was working at Rugby, I did once send in some HM jam tartlets (pastry base, HM strawberry jam, and sponge top to seal the jam in) to his work. One of his colleagues, a Muslim, tucked in happily, and only then asked if they were Halal. (They were, of course; and I never sent in my mince pies due to the alcohol content).

I do know what you mean about lard in pastry - it'd make me very ill if I were to eat it; I do remember someone knowing I was veggie, giving me some roasted spuds - I trusted him, and ate them, and was as sick as the proverbial dog afterwards. Turned out they'd been cooked in duck fat._pale_

Goldiegirl

Up until last year, I would eat anything that was put in front of me (except for Brussels sprouts, can't stand them!)

However, I now need to keep salt to a minimum in my diet, due to a chronic medical condition.

I've told my friends about this, so they know for when I have a meal round their house, and everybody has been very good about it.

I'm not salt intolerant and I don't have a salt allergy. But it's not fussiness either. It I have too much salt, I risk having vertigo, and each vertigo attack has the potential to damage my hearing and my balance system.

So I could end up deaf, and unable walk steadily, just through consuming too much salt.

To be honest, if people weren't willing to help me by serving me food that wasn't low in salt, I wouldn't go round there for a meal.

moneyistooshorttomention

I do find it very odd that some people will try and cover up that they have used an ingredient that they have been told will make someone ill or is morally objectionable to them (at a personal level).

Fortunately, I don't eat meat anyway - but, if I did, that is the one concession I wouldn't make (ie meat would be ordinary and not halal - whoever was coming round for a meal). However, I would tell anyone who did eat that way that that is how things are in advance and it would be up to them whether to accept the invite or no on that basis (monnogram's idea of them eating whatever way we eat in this country would be relevant here). But, as stated, that doesn't apply anyway in my case....

nuatha

Rosemary7391 wrote: »

I've never had more than one or two different requests at a time though. If I'm aware of something that someone just dislikes I'll try but the problem with asking is if everyone invited has conflicting likes/dislikes, what do you do?

I'd start from the lowest common denominator - usually vegan and nut free.
Catering our wedding a couple of years back we had vegan, lacto-vegetarian, ovo-lacto vegetarian, pescatarian and omnivore, in allergies we had nuts, coffee, gluten, fungi, diary. In addition we had folk who couldn't have aliums or fungi on religious grounds and a couple of people who would only eat parve.
Our answer was clear labelling and separation, but predominantly nut free vegan. The only allergy strong enough to be terminal was nuts, so everything was nut free (including my kitchen for three months, the time I spent catering everything).

mumps

kathrynha wrote: »

Totally agree about kids. I'm a Guide leader, and I remember one girl had a list of about 20 foods that were all she would eat, and they were all branded. Mother said it was fussiness not allergy/ intolerance that was the issue.
Child on camp pretty much ate everything put in front of her without mother pandering to her whims.

When catering for Guides we take in to account allergies, intolerances, vegetarianism and religious requirements. Fussiness is not taken into account. We provide a meal, no choice, although we do leave elements of the meal separate where possible. We encourage trying food, and if all else fails there is always bread.
Never had a child starve on camp.

As a child my DD had real issues with food and eating. I have lost count of the times I was told she would be fine on school holidays/guide camps etc. Yes, she would starve and as a 5 year old was threatened with hospital and tube feeding. Sometimes it really is more complicated than fussiness.

I know a doctor who found this to his cost, his child was like mine and he said it made him squirm to remember the mothers he had lectured about children not starving, they will eat in the end etc.

FairyPrincessk

I'm not sure the principle of this actually has changed. Instead, I suspect it is how we go about it.

As a very nerdy teenager I read several vintage etiquette books. Unfortunately I don't have access to them anymore, and my attempts to recall the precise book these past few days have failed me. Nonetheless, I do remember advice from a book published in the early 1900s suggesting discreet ways to find out your guests food preferences. If I remember correctly it was considered polite to make basic efforts for a single meal, but that more robust effort to cater to guests tastes were made for overnight guests. Interestingly it wasn't considered the done thing to just outright ask.

I think rationing is probably an interesting case. My guess is that the relatively small variety of food meant there were fewer issues during rationing. Since most food was fairly plain and made from a limited stock of ingredients there was just less to dislike and most people seemed to share a general dislike of much of the rations anyway (powdered eggs, national loaf, snoek, whale meat etc). You weren't expected to LIKE it.

On the other hand, there has been a proliferation of allergies and intolerances recently--weather that is down to more variety of food (and thus more exposure to a wider variety of foods), better diagnosis or something else, I suspect we're more open about the need to consider that not everyone can eat everything, and with the influx of more exotic foods it is also more likely that all of us will have a longer list of things they can't or won't eat. Coupled with greater informality in our etiquette in general, I think we're also more open about it.

The most recent gathering I went to was hosted by a boss and involved several colleagues. Of the six, there was one vegetarian, one who did not like aged, lye preserved fish, one who didn't like beetroot and one who avoided fennel. All of the dislikes are foods that are relatively easy to avoid, although I did think it would be a good wind up (but sad waste of food) if the host had plonked down a big warm salad made of the fish, fennel and beetroot.

As for me, well, I don't invite people into my home that I don't respect and I will go to great lengths to accommodate any needs of the people I do respect. That said, I'd be very worried about cross contamination for some allergies and would probably explain this and invite the guest to either bring their own or specify safe pre-packaged foods that I could provide for them as I would want to put their safety first.

moneyistooshorttomention

So far I think Nuatha wins the accolade for highest number of differing dietary requirements to cater for at once:rotfl::T and I just had to look up parve to see what it was...