Full rewire - what do I need to know? (Scotland)

edinburgher

We had loft insulation installed and the installers (British Gas) disturbed the cables to some of our lights. We are now unable to turn off our hall light.

I called BG, who sent out an electrician today. Not only did the electrician not fix the light, but he refused to work on it as it was not up to current IEE regulations etc. and he did not want to be liable.

He has also informed us that our recently replaced 17th edition circuit board is not up to code, as it is powered by a TRS cable. He said that an electrician is not allowed to attach this sort of cable to a new circuit board. In addition, because a certificate was not provided for the installation, we would not appear to have any recourse through the installer.

Long story short, he has advised that we need the following:

• Installation of an isolation switch before BG could rewire the property
• Full rewire, including a new circuit board and new wiring throughout

The quote provided was £3,800. I'm not asking if the quote is fair (he advised it would be on the high side), but rather what I need to look out for when getting other quotes?

I have no reason to believe he was anything other than honest and competent, but I thought that about the last guy!

My head is a bit sore at the moment, but from our discussion, I believe we need the following to make sure we cover ourselves for any work - could someone confirm?

• An installer registered with NICEIC (I assume they will have a registration number that I can check?)
• A test certificate for all works completed

Is there anything else we would need? Building regulations paperwork? Would my local council need a Completions Certificate?

Is there any sort of website that covers Scotland that will provide more information?

Sorry for all the questions, it has not been a good day.

phoenix_w

edinburgher wrote: »

Not only did the electrician not fix the light, but he refused to work on it as it was not up to current IEE regulations etc. and he did not want to be liable.

Sorry, can't help with most of your post, but just the bit I quote shows the guy's a charlatan. Electricians around the country every day make a good living fixing and amending existing systems which aren't to code. He most likely didn't want to do a laborious diagnostic job and decided to do the full sales pitch.

If you're really concerned about the safety of your electrics, find a good spark to write you an EICR. Whatever you do, do not employ the guy.

Edit: You should call the installer of your consumer unit and ask if you can have a copy of the install certificate (you should have one either printed or emailed to you) and point out that the BG guy thinks your meter tails are rubber. As long as the guy you employed is legit and accredited, both things are easily fixable (and there is also good chance your meter tails are absolutely fine and the BG guy was stretching the truth)

Crinkmeister

I find it very odd that a loft insulation installation could cause a change in how your lighting circuits work! Somebody has been messing with the wiring!! Sounds very suspicious to me but certainly does not warrant a full rewire. Basically, your lighting worked before BG came and now it doesn't because they have done something to it. Get your original sparky who changed you CCU to fix it and send BG the bill.

andyhop

Get a local sparky to check. Technicall electrics are recommended

brightontraveller

Diagram show typical layout

https://www.ukpowernetworks.co.uk/internet/en/help-and-advice/documents/A%20typical%20domestic%20power%20supply.pdf

1. The Mains/Service Cable
2. Cut-Out/Service Head
3. Meter Board
4. Main Fuse
5. Meter
6. Consumer Unit/Fuse Board
7. Meter Tails
8. Consumer Unit Tails

(identification numbers in link diagram)
Are they saying that cable connection (no 8) Consumer Unit Tails. supplied//feed from (no5 Meter), to (no.6) Consumer Unit/Fuse Board are rubber type if so and the rest of the installation is correct then you only need replace "(no 8) Consumer Unit Tails" normally only 2 meters of cable from (no5) Meter, these may go to a mains isolator then feed sub main board etc which could be further away

Not sure what BG mean by "Installation of an isolation switch before BG could rewire the property" but suspect they mean Fit lockable isolation switch after the meter ( allows isolation of complete Cu) some network suppliers insist on them on all new installations/meter changes etc but they tend to supply/fit them free or included in new supply cost its not down to the electrician to fit them normally?


I'd Get a EICR, Napit ECA Niciec , elecsa etc as something doesn’t appear correct with what BG are saying it may well have incorrect tails to cu but that doesn’t mean the place needs rewire although you got no cert installer is still responsible to rectify you paid them to do the job correctly not sure I’d have them back though Get a EICR......

edinburgher

If you're really concerned about the safety of your electrics, find a good spark to write you an EICR. Whatever you do, do not employ the guy.

This was a really good idea, thank you. I am arranging for a local firm to provide an EICR and have double checked that they are on the Scottish Government Certification Register.

I will not be contacting the original installer of the consumer unit at this point. He did not provide the certificate, the BG chap claimed that '70%' of private installers do not. This may have been an oversight, but if the original installer was dodgy, I don't want to start a conversation that basically says 'I think you're dodgy and am checking up on you'!

Basically, your lighting worked before BG came and now it doesn't because they have done something to it.

Completely agree, but I can't physically force them to work on my wiring!

Are they saying that cable connection (no 8) Consumer Unit Tails. supplied from (no5 Meter), to (no.6) Consumer Unit/Fuse Board are rubber type

I believe so.

Hopefully the EICR from an approved 3rd party will qualify what, if anything is required to keep us safe (and legal).

phoenix_w

edinburgher wrote: »

I will not be contacting the original installer of the consumer unit at this point. He did not provide the certificate, the BG chap claimed that '70%' of private installers do not. This may have been an oversight, but if the original installer was dodgy, I don't want to start a conversation that basically says 'I think you're dodgy and am checking up on you'!

This is a mistake. The original installer could be a bona fide electrician with lots of happy customers - even if you don't query about the meter tails, just ask if he can give you a copy of the install certificate - tell him you're thinking of selling up and the solicitor has asked you to ensure you've got the rewire cert and you can't find it.

Seems silly to spend any more pennies on work that may be completely unnecessary. Your electrics were absolutely fine before BG came, right? Chances are that a loose cable has been inadvertently pulled out of a switch/junction box or ceiling rose and your system is perfectly safe - just needs a touch of TLC from someone with a multimeter and half an hour's time to spare.

Brightontraveller's post is really informative - find where your meter is and visually inspect the cabling coming from it and heading towards the CU - is any of it rubber or does it look like PVC? If it is rubber then speak to the installer and tell him that your neighbour got his CU replaced and the guy who replaced his made a big deal of the tails needing to be replaced because rubber wiring is unsafe - ask him to check whether he replaced it.

DavidF

I would certainly get an EICR done anyway but aside from that I would be asking for quotes for the remedial work that has caused the lights to go off - I would then forward these quotes to BG and tell them to select their preferred bid. The fact that you may or may not need other work done is neither here nor there - I would have repaired the lighting circuit and supplied a certificate to show that the circuit I worked on was fully compliant and may have made a note on the certificate to the effect of anything obvious that I had found (not a full EICR as that would not have been what I would be there to do)...I am a fully qualified Electrician for 30+ years.

edinburgher

This is a mistake. The original installer could be a bona fide electrician with lots of happy customers - even if you don't query about the meter tails, just ask if he can give you a copy of the install certificate - tell him you're thinking of selling up and the solicitor has asked you to ensure you've got the rewire cert and you can't find it.

I have emailed him, but will not hold my breath!

Brightontraveller's post is really informative - find where your meter is and visually inspect the cabling coming from it and heading towards the CU - is any of it rubber or does it look like PVC?

I think I have got slightly confused here as our wiring does not look like the wiring in the example. Our meter tails (#7) are a mix of two older looking wires marked 'L' and 'N' going into the meter from a cable in the ceiling and two modern wires coming out of the meter and going into the consumer unit (also marked 'L' and 'N'). I am assuming that the newer wires were put in when the consumer unit was replaced.

The wire that the BG guy was getting concerned about is a black wire going directly into the consumer unit from the ceiling (it does not appear to be joined to the meter at all).

fluffpot

Some of my customers have been given very bad advice/info from British Gas in the past - take anything they say with a large pinch of salt. The advice to get and EICR done is a good place to start

jc808

If BG messed up my electrics while installing inslation, I would demand they repair it at their cost.