If a cheque is not honoured for whatever reason it's clear case of fraud

RS2000.

JethroUK wrote: »

It does not matter WHEN the intent occurs



Of course!!!!

That can not say "a duck ate their money" to evade fulfilling their promise - whether a duck ate it or they have to honour the PROMISE they made to pay

I'm not sure whether you don't understand because it's too complicated for you or whether it's because you are being deliberately obtuse

Whatever your reasons

I won't be explaining this to you any more

You are now being ignored

Just watch and learn for here on in

No dishonesty = no intent = no fraud.

I can't post it any easier for you to learn.

JethroUK

lucy03 wrote: »

N....If someone writes out a cheque and forgets [stuff] ....then that isn't fraud.

The most ridiculous point ever

Forgetting is not an excuse

I forgot the gun was loaded when I reeled off into a group

Neither is TIME

*When* you finally remember then

Pay your promise

Failure to do so is fraud!!!!!!!!!!!!

Obviously!!!!!!

Again you are now being ignored

hollydays

Rah ! RAH! Rah! :rotfl:

RS2000.

JethroUK wrote: »

The most ridiculous point ever

Forgetting is not an excuse

I forgot the gun was loaded when I reeled off into a group

Neither is TIME

*When* you finally remember then

Pay your promise

Failure to do so is fraud!!!!!!!!!!!!

Obviously!!!!!!

Again you are now being ignored

You need to prove dishonesty burying you head in the sand and pressing ignore will not change that fact.

unholyangel

JethroUK wrote: »

It does not matter WHEN the intent occurs



Of course!!!!

That can not say "a duck ate their money" to evade fulfilling their promise - whether a duck ate it or they have to honour the PROMISE they made to pay

I'm not sure whether you don't understand because it's too complicated for you or whether it's because you are being deliberately obtuse

Whatever your reason

I won't be explaining this to you any more

You are now being ignored

Just watch and learn for here on in

Do you even know what intent is?

If you won't believe us, perhaps you'd believe Citizens Advice:
http://www.adviceguide.org.uk/england/debt_e/debt_banking_e/cheques.htm#h_cancelling_cheques

It's not against the law to stop a cheque. However, it is a criminal offence to hand over a cheque with the intention of stopping it later, although this can be difficult to prove. If you hand over a cheque knowing that the bank or building society won't pay the amount, that is, it will bounce the cheque, this is also a criminal offence.

If you buy something by cheque and then you stop the cheque, court action can be taken against you for the money owing.

See the last part in particular....they can take action against you for the money owing but it does not necessarily amount to a criminal offence UNLESS the intent of defrauding was there.

pvt

JethroUK wrote: »

Errrrrr YES they are

Well !!!!!! are you telling me for, I was just quoting the Cheque & Credit Clearing Company, who process every one of the 750 million cheques a year that are issued in the UK. It's them who've clearly got it wrong on their website. It's them you need to tell.

This is why I don't use cheques any more - the authority that is clearing them, and everyone else on this thread, doesn't even know what they are. Jedd, you appear to be the only person who does.

If I need any help in court on this topic I'll give you a shout Champ. :wave:

agrinnall

Should I count the fact that our pal Jethro was so annoyed with my post in particular that he put me on Ignore as a badge of honour?

LilElvis

I don't think I've written a cheque in the last 10 years. Even my parents (in their mid/late 70s) don't use them any more.

The only thing this thread has taught me is that the OP gets rather cross, rather quickly over a pretty trivial discussion.

Ectophile

JethroUK wrote: »

Quite, but WHEN that intent occurred is not

Are you getting this yet?

You seem to be assuming that the person who wrote the cheque ever intended it to bounce.

If there is not enough money in the account to honour the cheque, then the bank will bounce it.

The person who wrote the cheque may not even know that it has bounced until they are informed by the person expecting to be paid.

If the person who wrote the cheque did so believing that it would be honoured by the bank, then there was never any intent to defraud, and a charge of fraud always requires intent.

Sticking your fingers in your ears and saying "laa laa laa, I can't hear you" when people try to explain this to you doesn't change anything. And, quite frankly, I don't really care if you decide to ignore me after you read this post.

RuthnJasper

Am I missing something?! What in the name of high holy Hades is all this about? And why does it matter?!

Bizarre.