HSBC (UK); ISO 20022 Pain.008 XML Direct Debit - How and Where?

ConfusedOne0

Hi All,
I called several times HSBC (UK) and asked them from where could I obtain file request for doing direct debit so debited funds arrive to HSBC account. I was asking where could I get this file so I could know which info (columns?) must exist, which info is mandatory and which recommended or even not needed/required. I also wanted to ask where could I upload/transfer such file to the bank since HSBC clearly has nothing like this in online banking? Not even ONE single representative was able to help. Everyone told me they never heard about such activity (see title of the post), e.g. ISO20022 or excel files. Could someone tell me step by step instructions about this please? I don't know where to start. Don't even know where to obtain the needed blank file which I need to fill. No idea what could I do with the file once it is filled. Also if you reply and I would like to ask you to please do so, kindly keep an eye on this topic as I will surely reply on your message. Thank you in advance.

TrustyOven

What exactly are you after?

If it's the format of the XML file, then a 5 second Google search brought me to a PDF describing the XML format.

If it's where to use it in HSBC online banking... I have no idea - never heard about this until now.

If it's why someone should use this - I have no idea about this at all.

The PDF I found contains information to tell you what is mandatory...

TrustyOven

Also, why do you need this?
What are you trying to achieve?

My 5 minutes worth of reading on this topic suggests this is not something customers should be doing. It'd be more for programmers creating some sort of payment processing system or bank transaction thingy like Paypal or any of the other payment processors. Or maybe for utility companies etc to allow them to create direct debits.

Surely that'd be extremely specialised and not something you could sensibly discuss with normal bank customer support representatives.

ConfusedOne0

Thank you for your reply. I need to debit particular accounts after I got signed authorization forms as agreement for business but now I am in complete ''dark'' as I know NOTHING what to do. All I have is main banking info (e.g. account number, accountholder name, swift/iban/bic,...) of accounts and obviously my HSBC (UK) account info. Thats all. No idea what should I do to debit those accounts (within sepa)? I checked countless of resources found via google and even software programs claiming to simplify the procedure of ISO20022 for both direct debit and direct credit but nothing helps. Surely this cannot be done within online banking, I checked everything there. Could you please tell me who else should I ask? I even went to the hsbc branch and still no luck. You cannot just google format of xml for iso20022 because different banks have different templates, different requirements - the XML columns what to be filled and what not. I have been researching this on google for weeks. Sources won't help, I need human's help please...

Hazzanet

Found this using google:

http://businessbanking.bankofireland.com/fs/doc/wysiwyg/sepa-direct-debit-pain-008-001-02-xml-file-structure-july-2013.pdf

Are the DDs within the UK only? If so, you probably need an APACS18 file.

Hazzanet

ConfusedOne0 wrote: »

You cannot just google format of xml for iso20022 because different banks have different templates, different requirements - the XML columns what to be filled and what not. I have been researching this on google for weeks. Sources won't help, I need human's help please...

The point of an ISO is that it is an International Standard (The IS bit of ISO) so it should be following the same schema across the piece. The BOI example above should be the same.

Similarly, if I create a UK APACS18 file, HSBC or Barclays would be able to read it without issue, as it is a BACS standard format.

Gingernutty

ConfusedOne0 wrote: »

I need to debit particular accounts after I got signed authorization forms as agreement for business but now I am in complete ''dark'' as I know NOTHING what to do.

All I have is main banking info (e.g. account number, accountholder name, swift/iban/bic,...) of accounts and obviously my HSBC (UK) account info. Thats all. No idea what should I do to debit those accounts (within sepa)?

The owners of the bank accounts you want the money from, should have arranged the direct debits from their accounts so that the money can go to your account.

Why are you trying to debit someone elses' accounts?

The banks should be doing this.

What you're asking about is the sort of programming that the banks themselves use.

pmduk

You might be better trying the BACS site. Remember in the UK you have to get authorisation to create/take Direct Debits.

grumbler

Gingernutty wrote: »

The owners of the bank accounts you want the money from, should have arranged the direct debits from their accounts so that the money can go to your account.

Really? How could they do this?
The owners give a permission/authorisation to a company to set a DD. The company with help of its bank makes the arrangements.

ConfusedOne0

Hazzanet: I found countless of resources on my own already and nothing really helped. I would need method (collection) how to obtain the file for (my chosen searches):

whether it is bank or credit union
name of bank or credit union
whether direct debit or direct credit
physical location of bank or credit union

I assume any and every institution (referring to both bank and credit union) won't modify the requirements if debited/credited funds are directed to A sepa country instead of B one.

GingernuttGingernutty: I apologize for correcting you but nothing what you said is valid. There is no human (bank/cu) work involved. This is automated procedure, once file transfered, done automatically. Noone would be handling this. That is why ISO20022 is for. Owner of account won't and cannot arrange this. If it is direct debit then always account owner of account where debited funds will be deposited, uses/uploads the file. Never owner of those funds that are going to be debited. If is direct CREDIT instead of debit then always owner who is requesting the transaction (owner of funds) have to upload the file. Never receiver. To answer your question: I would like to debit to process transaction once authorization form (purpose of selling the product) is signed.

pmduk: Everywhere the authorization is needed and not just in UK but this is given by client (account holder of account to be debited) and not bank/cu employee since the procedure is automated.

grumbler: I agree with this only partially. No bank/cu employee would arrange anything at all. No receiver (whether company or individual) would be, at his/her/their right state of mind, be willing to jeopardize his/her/their earnings with bank/cu employee's WILLIGNESS whether or not to process the request and/or whether or not to decline it.

Anyway, I would still like to know where could I get those files based on bolded text in this message.

grumbler

ConfusedOne0 wrote: »

....No receiver (whether company or individual) would be, at his/her/their right state of mind, be willing to jeopardize his/her/their earnings with bank/cu employee's WILLIGNESS whether or not to process the request and/or whether or not to decline it.

Have I said anything about 'willingness'?
My experience is very limited as I am an individual, not a business, but I simply ask the bank (Tesco in this case) to set a DD up on some other account that I give them details of, and they process my request.