Getting USD/Euro fee free without a loaded exchange rate

adindas

eDicky wrote: »

Did you try any Visa cards, to see if the conversion choices are given?

I have tried Santander Zero Visa debitcard, in several MoneyCorps cash machines in Stansted and the option of either "to proceed with conversion or without conversion" is simply not there (post #43)

There is a good chance it might work with VISA credit cards as I suspect all of the creditcards issued here in the UK (not just Mastercards) do not have link application in it. But I do not have any zero fee for foreign currency transaction Visa creditcards to try so did not try it.

zerog

I'm not surprised that debit cards don't work. LINK is the domestic GBP only network similar to EFTPOS in Aus/NZ, Interac in Canada, EPS in Hong Kong. Eurozone countries also have these but I can't remember the names, but it is why only Dutch cards work at most Dutch rail stations.

Basically this routes the transaction directly between the bank and the ATM so avoiding the Mastercard and Visa retailer fees. If these networks are bypassed then the option to use the MC or Visa exchange rates is also bypassed.

fifeken

adindas wrote: »

2. UK Credit cards (might be all UK credit cards ?), do not have Link application on it so if you withdraw money using Mastercard credit cards such as Halifax Clarity Creditcard, Santander Zero Creditcards, “Link application” will not take effect as there is no lonk application in there.

This bit cannot be true as I have just been advised by Halifax that I require a Link enabled machine to unlock the PIN on my Clarity Card.

The machine configuration/connection also has to be taken into account.

adindas

This might be a simplification statement as apart from cash machines which you will need to pay for cash withdrawal (e.g in convenience shops) almost all (if not all) of UK cash machines displaying Visa/Masters logo will have link connection at the same machines. For the card itself, it does not necessary mean that it has link application in it.

The word link form Halifax (and BoS I have noticed as well) is actually refering to the same thing with Visa/Master logo to avoid. here is their statements
http://www.halifax.co.uk/creditcards/help-guidance/existing-customers/

" You can change or unlock your credit card PIN at any cash machine that displays the Link symbol ..."

In fact from other bank infos you will normally find the wording you unlock yourcard at ANY cash machines or cash machines which display the Visa/Mastercard logo ...".

Also common sense rule if the card is acticated based on Link appplication alone without Master/Visa intervention, it could only be used here in the UK as Link is just a UK network and will not be recognised abroad, same case with CashCard UK debit card. In fact The UK credit card could be used abroad in almost any cash machines displaying Visa/Master logo.

It is also mentioned here :
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LINK_(UK)
"UK issued debit cards generally come with a LINK EMV application in addition to a point of sale EMV application that can be Visa (Debit), (Debit) MasterCard or UnionPay[11] applications. "

Creditcard is never mentioned here.

The Halifax (and Bos) use the wording Link might be for simplification as almost all (if not all) of UK cash machines displaying Visa/Masters logo will have link connection. So when you activate the card it is actually using Visa/Master network rather then Link application, but this is open for discussion ...

fifeken wrote: »

This bit cannot be true as I have just been advised by Halifax that I require a Link enabled machine to unlock the PIN on my Clarity Card.

The machine configuration/connection also has to be taken into account.

System

Virtually all UK ATMs are connected to LINK.

LINK is used for UK non-issuer cash card / debit card withdrawals (i.e. Current / Savings accounts) but can be used as a gateway for withdrawals from other networks such as MasterCard/Cirrus, Visa/Plus and Discover but this function is optional.

Therefore, the latter would still be using LINK but will essentially be processed according to rules of the end network e.g. MasterCard / Cirrus

chattychappy

Your humble OP is delighted to see adindas and others going to so much trouble to get to the bottom of this.

I just tried the Moneycorp machines at Gatwick S departures. My experience matches others:

• Nationwide Visa debit: no choice - must accept conversion
• Nationwide Visa credit card: can choose to avoid conversion

as before:

• Santander Zero Mastcard credit card: can choose to avoid conversion
• Halifax Clarity Mastercard credit card: can choose to avoid conversion

So the pattern does seem to be that you must use a CC (either Visa/Mastercard) to avoid conversion.


Also I have yet to find a non-Moneycorp ATM that allows you to avoid conversion whatever you put in.


I'll pass through Heathrow next week and try a few other combinations then. Shortly I'll edit my original post for the benefit of newcomers to this thread.

eDicky

chattychappy wrote: »

• Nationwide Visa credit card: can choose to avoid conversion
  
  Also I have yet to find a non-Moneycorp ATM that allows you to avoid conversion whatever you put in.

Reviewing the latest relevant points above, and the previous posts in general, we can summarise what is probable or still uncertain:

• Regarding the reason why the opportunity for non-DCC exchange is possible for certain cards in the Moneycorp multicurrency ATMs, the 'Link theory' now seems more likely than the 'IT glitch' theory. But the question still remains - why only Moneycorp machines give conversion choice and not Travelex and Raphael Bank also?
• Apparently, the conversion choice is offered when using both Visa and MasterCard CREDIT cards, but not offered when using Visa and MasterCard bank-issued DEBIT cards, presumably according to whether Link application is applied or not. But once again, non-Moneycorp machines somehow avoid giving the choice even to credit cards (unless we are still to discover otherwise).
• I specified bank-issued debit cards, because on Tuesday I discovered that prepaid debit cards used in the ATMs at Stansted ARE given the conversion choice, when I tried my Orangecash MasterCard, Cashplus MasterCard and Talk Home Visa. Could this be because they do not have Link application? Or because they operate effectively as credit cards for transactions? (They incur credit card charges when due for certain purchases such as air tickets.) However, the Talk Home card seems to be pure debit card and does not incur credit card charges for purchases.
• Then there is the question of whether this opportunity for pure exchange rates will or can be withdrawn somehow by Moneycorp if it is brought to public attention. I doubt there will be a rush to use it as the cost of a special trip to the airport will mostly outweigh the savings.

lafesta

Couple years back when I tested my Metro Bank debit card (Mastercard) in a foreign country (EU), I tried 4 or 5 different bank ATMs. Only 1 ATM gave me the option to chose/opt-out on DCC. The other ones just gave me the money, but the conversion was done at Mastercard exchange rates, not with DCC.

It seems to me the Mastercard/VISA rules apply only when using a X country issued card in a Y country to get Y's currency and are:
- If DCC is used*/offered, the "withdraw without conversion" option must be offered (so in effect getting cash at Mastercard/VISA exchange rates);
- If DCC is not used*/offered, the Mastercard/VISA exchange rates will be used.

*Only some banks are using/offering DCC.


Regarding the UK ATMs offering foreign currency, I think is like going to a Bureau de Change, same rules apply. Is not your usual ATM per se.

adindas

lafesta wrote: »

Couple years back when I tested my Metro Bank debit card (Mastercard) in a foreign country (EU), I tried 4 or 5 different bank ATMs. Only 1 ATM gave me the option to chose/opt-out on DCC. The other ones just gave me the money, but the conversion was done at Mastercard exchange rates, not with DCC.

1. The likelyhood is that you are using the local bank cash machines and not Global Bank (e,g. Deutsche bank in Germany, BNP Paribas, etc) or the bank with the Euronet network which is normally available in the tourist areas.

Local bank ouitside the tourist area are normally for local people to withdraw local currency. So no benefit here to offer DCC option. If they do not do conversion like the local bank cash machines in this case, they do not need to offer the DCC option.

lafesta wrote: »

It seems to me the Mastercard/VISA rules apply only when using a X country issued card in a Y country to get Y's currency and are:
- If DCC is used*/offered, the "withdraw without conversion" option must be offered (so in effect getting cash at Mastercard/VISA exchange rates);
- If DCC is not used*/offered, the Mastercard/VISA exchange rates will be used.

*Only some banks are using/offering DCC.

2. I fully belief this is the case and this is in line with the above comment no1.

lafesta wrote: »

Regarding the UK ATMs offering foreign currency, I think is like going to a Bureau de Change, same rules apply. Is not your usual ATM per se.

3. If you read the entire thread, the following is the temporary conclusion for foreign currency withdrawal in the UK. If people are using CreditCards (E.g either Master or Visa) and NOT debit card in the Moneycorps cash machines, they will be presented with DCC option. So if you are using specialist card such as Clarity or Santander Zero Creditcard and select to "proceed without conversion," you will be getting mastercard global exchange rate.

4. This seems to be just applicable to MoneyCoprs Cash machines, as using Credit Card to withdraw cash in other cash machines such as Raphael bank, you will not have a DCC option and you will get the exchange rate set up by Raphael bank exchange rate.

Anyone want to try other option from different cash machines in the UK other than Moneycoprs using credit cards ???

Could it be just an IT glitch from Moneycoprs cash machines ????

gizz_mo

Does anyone one know what will happen if I try the new Travelex Supercard to withdraw EUR from a UK ATM such as Moneycorp, Raphaels or the one mentioned in Paddington or Bishopsgate?