Speeding ticket-offence 0n 17/2/15-NIP dated 18/3/15-received 20/3??

skiboy1

:beer:Speeding offence on 17/2/15-NIP dated 18/3/15 & received 20/3???

***Duplicated as originally put on parking ticket section in error-apologies****
Hi all. Received a speeding NIP on 20/3. Offence was dated 17/2/15. Letter has date of 18/3/2015???! On checking the website & viewing the offence the NIP online says 18/2/2015 but was received by me 20/3/15-the 'hard copy' letter shows 18/3/2015? Surely this is not enforceable as received way over the 14 day period? My registered keeper details are bang up to date by the way. Any thoughts?

Edit-it also says online 'new driver nominated on 19/3/2015 !??' I've been the registered keeper at this address for years?

Nodding_Donkey

Pepipoo is probably the best place to post for advice on how to deal with this.

HO87

skiboy1 wrote: »

Hi all. Received a speeding NIP on 20/3. Offence was dated 17/2/15. Letter has date of 18/3/2015???! On checking the website & viewing the offence the NIP online says 18/2/2015 but was received by me 20/3/15-the 'hard copy' letter shows 18/3/2015? Surely this is not enforceable as received way over the 14 day period? My registered keeper details are bang up to date by the way. Any thoughts?

Edit-it also says online 'new driver nominated on 19/3/2015 !??' I've been the registered keeper at this address for years?

The issue of an out-of-time NIP is, for the moment, of secondary concern and I'll come back to it.

It is normal for a s.172 requirement to be attached to the NIP requiring you to nominate the driver at the time of the alleged offence. That requirement has a 28-day limit within which you must furnish the police the details they require. Whether the NIP it is attached to is flawed or not is irrelevant to the validity of the requirement. Failing to respond appropriately will render you liable to a stiff fine (£350-500 or even higher is routine) and a mandatory imposition of 6 points.

The endorsement code (MS90) is particularly unpopular with insurers so you could expect a significant uplift in premiums as a minimum. Some insurers have revoked policies, when notified, and others have refused to offer cover to motorists who carry that endorsement.

The advice therefore has to be to ensure you provide the driver's details. If if was you then you should answer truthfully. Equivocation will be interpreted as a failure to furnish and many forces will not offer a second chance but merely issue a summons.

The law requires that a NIP is given either verbally at the time of an alleged offence (there are specific offences for which it must be given) or put in writing and served on the driver or registered keeper within 14 days. If that is not done then the recipient cannot be convicted - but that is not to say that he might not be summonsed to court. The 14-day limit applies to only the first NIP. No subsequent NIP is so constrained.

The sequence of dates given follows no logic that I can see through but the implication is that the NIP you have received is not the first in the sequence and from that point of view the 14-day limit may be irrelevant. I would suggest that you do not second-guess the situation and supply the information required within the time limit. Attaching a letter to the completed form supplied pointing out the date issue would be sensible.

You RK details may be up to date but is it possible that the vehicle record was updated at the time of the alleged offence or immediately afterwards? Are you sure that the NIP relates to your vehicle? Could a partner/friend/colleague have been stopped whilst using it and given their name but are now claiming (resulting in the issue of the NIP/s.172 to you) that you were driving? Only you will know the circumstances and that is not disclosed in your post.

HTH

skiboy1

Hi H087-THANKS so much! Ok-was me driving at the time. DVLA have had my details correct for last 3 years. The NIP shown in digital form is IDENTICAL (all pins/reference numbers etc) to the 'hard copy' one received by post-except the hard copy one is dated 18/3/15. Also-1 received ANOTHER NIP on same date-for an offence on 10/3-which obviously i'll pay & opt for the driver awareness course-interesting thing is both were sent on 18/3-human error maybe?

Also the second offence is deffo a different date & time-I've viewed the pictures. No one else has access to my vehicle.

The thing that puzzles me is the 'new driver nominated on 19/3'-not got a clue on that as i said DVLA have correct info for last 3 years? I've got to nip out now (funnily enough to the same place where the offence took place-I'll be slow lol!)-but will reply this afternoon.

Anyone know of any good free mobile/fixed/traffic light poi downloads? I have an old (2010) garmin nuvi with the 'nt' uk 2014 maps. Any ideas? Are there any cheap yearly ones that update in 'real' time-seen some online at 9-95 a month?

SuperAllyB

Most, if not all, councils supply speed limit signs at the side of the road free of charge. Observe and respect these and you won't need to worry about traffic cameras.

skiboy1

Oh shut p Superallyb....not hrlpfull. Still...if posting that floats your boat lol!

SuperAllyB

Would actually help as much as any electronic device.

Johno100

SuperAllyB wrote: »

Most, if not all, councils supply speed limit signs at the side of the road free of charge. Observe and respect these and you won't need to worry about traffic cameras.

Hope you've remembered to polish your halo this morning.

Marktheshark

The Postmark or Frank is the evidential part you need.
Dates on letters can be wrong and can be changed, postmarks or franking stamps can not.
They prove when it was posted. Unfortunatly most people chuck the envelope.

Spicy_McHaggis

Marktheshark wrote: »

The Postmark or Frank is the evidential part you need.
Dates on letters can be wrong and can be changed, postmarks or franking stamps can not.
They prove when it was posted. Unfortunatly most people chuck the envelope.

How are they going to change the date on the OPs letter?

It's possible the slip rule could come into play but only if the offence date was 17/03/15. However as the nip is a fundamental part of the prosecution it isn't a simple mistake and would possibly prove fatal to their prosecution.

Given the facts the OP has I'd run with their letter and let them prove when they posted it. There evidence so far suggests they have sat on it for a month.

If it's a February offence the nip is too late.

OP were you at the offence location on 17/03/15?

HO87

THIS COULD BE IMPORTANT

Just to clarify, is it possible that the actual date of the offence was 17 March, as opposed to the date that is shown on the form - i.e. 17 February?

Bear in mind what the form asks for. It alleges, possibly incorrectly, that the driver of your vehicle committed an offence at a fixed timeand at a fixed location on 17 February. Do not be tempted to second guess here. They may have made a mistake but this is an official, legal requirement and you must answer only the question asked. That is who was driving at the time on 17 Ferbuary. Were you driving the vehicle at that time? If so were you at the location they allege?

If not - and they have messed up the dates - then you need to be careful about your response. If you weren't using the vehicle at the date and time they allege then there is a specific procedure you will need to follow to deal with this. I'll not go through that yet - unless it becomes necessary. Importantly, if you weren't driving the vehicle and it wasn't at the location they allege on 17 February (as they have asked) then do not do anything until I have advised further as far as that first NIP is concerned.