PCN company car

Kayleighb1

The pcn doesn't mention BPA, or POFA, but it does say that I can appeal to IAS.

Any advice? This has thrown me a bit as it was all POFA and popla for my pcn last year.

bod1467

There are 2 Approved Trade Associations (ATAs) ... the British parking Association (BPA, whose appeal route is POPLA), and the Independent Parking Committee (IPC, whose appeal route is IAS).

Excel were BPA members but jumped ship to IPC. Therefore you cannot get a POPLA appeal as IPC members offer IAS. IAS is a kangaroo court (legally-sound appeals are rejected by their nameless "barrister" assessor) and many believe appeals to them are a waste of time and effort.

Kayleighb1

So ought i just to pay it?

What happens when appeal and iAs appeal fails?

My husband is going to return tomrrow to see if the signage is still BPA or if it has been changed to ipc. In case we have a line of defense that we thought they were BPA regulated.

bod1467

Kayleighb1 wrote: »

So ought i just to pay it? Who on earth here ever suggests that?

What happens when appeal and iAs appeal fails? You ignore anything sent to you by them or their debt collector chums (except a compliant letter before claim or actual court papers, assuming you actually DO receive either)

My husband is going to return tomrrow to see if the signage is still BPA or if it has been changed to ipc. In case we have a line of defense that we thought they were BPA regulated.

See comments above.

Kayleighb1

Ok again thank you for replies.

My new letter. Responses would be very welcome.

PCN




Date


Dear Sirs

Re: PCN No. ....................

I have been passed this 'PCN' to reply to from xxxlease company , as I am the usual keeper of the car, though not always the driver. Please find permission attached for me to deal with this.

My postal address for future correspondence is xxxx

My email address for future correspondence is: xxxx

I challenge this 'PCN' as keeper of the car, on these main grounds:

a). The sum does not represent a genuine pre-estimate of loss, nor is it a core price term. It is a disguised penalty and not commercially justified.
b). As keeper I believe that the signs were not seen, the wording is ambiguous and the predominant purpose of your business model is intended to be a deterrent.
c). There is no evidence that you have any proprietary interest in the land. I require the contract with the landowner is produced, as Excel are not the landowners and I contend you have no legal standing to pursue this charge.
d). Your 'Notice' fails to comply with the POFA 2012 and breaches various consumer contract/unfair terms Regulations. In addition, since you fail to allow a POPLA appeal, the POFA requirement on the driver is removed.
e). There was no consideration nor acceptance flowing from both parties and any contract with myself or the driver is denied.
f). This is not a parking ticket, it is an unsolicited invoice.
g). It doesn’t comply with Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999

There will be no admissions as to who was driving and no assumptions can be drawn. As such, you must cancel the charge. I suggest you uphold this challenge now or alternatively, send a rejection letter. I am aware that your trade association also offers a further challenge to the IAS, however I have serious concerns over the true independence and effectiveness of the IAS and should they rule against my challenge, which I WILL make, I reserve my rights to reject their findings.

I also reserve the right to see the evidence of the other party before a decision is made.

I have kept proof of submission of this challenge. I look forward to your considered reply within 35 days.

Yours faithfully,

Xxxx
{the keeper's name}

bod1467

Why are you still mentioning POPLA? (We've already covered this).

Kayleighb1

Read on another thread that because they are not using popla any more that they can't get me under POFA.

Is that not true then?

In addition if their signage isn't updated from BPA, I can still request popla?

bod1467

If the PCN is dated after they switched to the IPC then POPLA cannot be used - it is IAS.

IPC are an ATA - Excel being in an ATA means they can get keeper details using POFA. Indeed they already did - the registered keeper was your company/lease company, and they have passed the NtK to you.

If the signage says BPA (with no mention of IPC) then you have another appeal point - the signage cannot legally enforce a contract as it does not convey correct information, thus breaches the CPUTR and UTCCR. (Google the acronyms). But it does not mean you can demand POPLA.

Kayleighb1

Ok if I take that out is the rest of the letter good to go please?

Redx

letter is good if you remove any BPA or POPLA references, hope you are finally understanding what we have been telling you all along

so no s clark , no popla , no BPA , no drivers details, no RK details , appeal as keeper

they will probably refuse it and refer you to the IAS, either you appeal to the biased in favor of the PPC IAS , or you dont, its also likely that will fail too

put last year with JLA out of your head, VCS (JLA) and EXCEL (Peel centre) are sister companies, both are now in the IPC

POFA 2012 still applies, if they choose to try to use it, but many companies dont bother with POFA 2012 anyway

so yes, doctor your appeal so it fits the IPC scenario, with IAS as the appeal process , think of it as like shopping in asda last year and tesco this year, both are supermarkets with similar products, but you cannot complain about asda cheese in tescos)