Salmond and Sturgeon Want the English Fish for More Fat Subsidies

ruggedtoast

Shakethedisease wrote: »

This morning on BBC Good Morning Scotland.

Smaller countries with small populations also tend to do quite well in the Western world. Scotland needs to become less reliant on fossil fuels over time and needs to diversify it's economic activities, and restructure it's economy. Oil is going to run out or perhaps become unprofitable to extract at some point anyway. May as well make a start towards an economy that deals with that sooner rather than later.. SNP MP's at Westminster is just the beginning of that.

Left to Westminster, Scotland will never have the chance to do any of the above, or improve it's position. And it's not like the UK as a whole isn't facing bad times ahead with big cuts as it is anyway.

And like you say, there's a good chance oil will rebound at some point. Not that I'd wish a war in order that happens though. It s all uncertain. I've said several times now that the referendum is over that things will happen in a more gradual manner. ( Unless there's another reason to hold a referendum ). But once whatever powers Scotland gets go to Holyrood, there's very little chance they'll ever be taken back. Just think it it as 'loosening ties' gradually in the below area's, rather than severing them all at once. There's much more to this than oil prices.

Thats it Shakey, don't give up!

kabayiri

Shakethedisease wrote: »

There will be no Labour/SNP coalition. It'll be either a confidence and supply agreement ( deals done beforehand in forming government in order to secure SNP votes, for a more stable basis to move forward )... or much more likely, on a vote by vote basis on every issue that comes up. Which is much less stable. I suspect the SNP will sit back and let Tories/Labour slug it out over a lot of issues, and just abstain. That could make things difficult for Labour if the Tories and other parties have more seats overall.. and Labour may have to cut a few deals here and there in order to gain SNP support. Fixed term parliaments mean calling a new election is much more difficult than it used to be.
...

This is the biggest argument for me to support a Tory-led future government.

We need a government with a clear mandate to take the hard decisions.

Your vision described above is too half hearted; too piecemeal.

ruggedtoast

I like how that the narrative about Scotland's future being secured with the riches of oil has now been turned on its head, and the oil industry sinking is now Scotland's greatest asset. Back to wind power then, at least the Nats aren't short of that.

Generali

ruggedtoast wrote: »

I like how that the narrative about Scotland's future being secured with the riches of oil has now been turned on its head, and the oil industry sinking is now Scotland's greatest asset. Back to wind power then, at least the Nats aren't short of that.

They'll need a lot of it. The fall in the prices of oil and gas mean that renewables are even less competitive than they were.

I don't doubt that the Scottish economy has some great ways to grow especially via whisky and tourism. I also don't really see that the Government is likely to help much in either case except by mostly letting the companies get on with it.

In fact, from my limited understanding of the history of whisky, mostly gleaned from bottle labels, I believe that one of the things that allowed the whisky industry to flourish in Scotland was that in remote areas it was very hard for the customs men to find the stills and tax them.

kabayiri

A good friend of mine working in the area thinks we will have a commercial Fusion reactor somewhere in the world by 2030. His views are not considered maverick either.

The market for oil *will* change, inside 1 or 2 generations.

In general, this is a good thing

ruggedtoast

Let's see what's going on over on the Nationalist groups now.

Well, it's lovely over there as usual. This report has come out:

http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/politics/independence-referendum-figures-revealed-majority-5408163

And they are fervently wishing that the older people would hurry up and die, and that they can get rid of the 'foreigners' whom they now blame for their non independence. And homeowners, and people with jobs.

The nationalist oldies are getting well riled and pointing out that they were intolerant anti-English bigots long before the current crop of xenophobes were born! Well, that is a good point I suppose.

Somewhat contradicts the everyone is welcome narrative that didn't seem especially convincing earlier, eh?

Really worrying signs of racism up there. Anyone on the ground (who isn't STD) able to comment on what it's like now we are 6 months post NO?

kabayiri

ruggedtoast wrote: »

I like how that the narrative about Scotland's future being secured with the riches of oil has now been turned on its head, and the oil industry sinking is now Scotland's greatest asset. Back to wind power then, at least the Nats aren't short of that.

Qualification alert!

Narrative = political storyline = flight of fancy = found in the fiction section of your Library

Generali

ruggedtoast wrote: »

they are fervently wishing that the older people would hurry up and die, and that they can get rid of the 'foreigners' whom they now blame for their non independence. And homeowners, and people with jobs.

Given that SNP supporters have rather a lot of form, this is really quite a worrying report.

Having said that, Nationalists showing themselves for what they are generally puts off the decent majority.

Shakethedisease

kabayiri wrote: »

This is the biggest argument for me to support a Tory-led future government.

We need a government with a clear mandate to take the hard decisions.

Your vision described above is too half hearted; too piecemeal.

Unfortunately it's not my vision. It's what the polls have all been saying for months. Neither Tories or Labour are looking set to win a majority. And the SNP ( helped along by the Lib Dem collapse ) are looking like being the third largest party.

Tories would have to try and cobble together a coalition or make deals with what was left of the Lib Dems ( and only the leadership seems very keen on another one, not the grassroots ).. or/and UKIP/DUP. Even then that's not a likely harmonious collection of parties. Nor does it look like having enough numbers perhaps even then. That also looks piecemeal and may be on a vote, by vote basis for some or all parties.

The SNP have stated they won't work with the Tories at all, but will with Labour on a confidence and supply basis ( which is where the 'red lines' come in ).. or on a vote by vote basis through the next parliament. There are also now rumblings of 'talks' between the SNP and more Leftwing Labour 'factions'..

Neil Lawson, the chairman of Compass, which has close links to “democratic left” MPs and green groups, confirmed he been discussing tactics with the SNP but has cautioned the party not to make direct approaches to Labour MPs until after the general election.

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2015/mar/31/snp-plans-approach-leftwing-labour-mps-progressive-bloc-after-election?CMP=share_btn_tw

As things stand (polls), is looking like even if Tories gain the most seats. They won't have the 'confidence of the house'. And won't be able to form a working government unless Labour vote to put them there ( the SNP have said they will vote against a possible Tory-led govt being formed ). Labour voting Tories in again is an unlikely prospect as it would mean walking away from power off their own bat. They couldn't blame anyone else. Plaid, and Greens, are already allied with SNP in terms of how they'll vote.

But, no, it's not my 'vision'. That's how things work rule wise in parliament forming governments. We vote in the MP's, but it's the MP's that have to form a government somehow..and based on the arithmetic on May 8th, it all looks messy. We're too used probably to two party politics. I guess the Tories will definitely be needing your vote.

But mabye the polls will change soon as more people engage etc etc.

Shakethedisease

Generali wrote: »

Given that SNP supporters have rather a lot of form, this is really quite a worrying report.

Having said that, Nationalists showing themselves for what they are generally puts off the decent majority.

Smear and fear from the Daily Labour... must be an election coming up.