Our stock used, whilst our unit was CLOSED.

[Deleted User]

[FONT=&quot]Hoping that one of your experts may be able to help us. [/FONT]


[FONT=&quot]Will also be speaking to our solicitor in the morning (if they are open) [/FONT]
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[FONT=&quot]Recently we worked for a local hotel, providing games, in which some damage occurred. We don’t accept that we caused this but the hotel effectively blamed us and we had some discussions. [/FONT]
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[FONT=&quot]We were asked as a result and maybe as a gesture, to provide some food stands for their Christmas parties, these are hot food stands.
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[FONT=&quot]We have been providing these at cost, and have been making no money at all. We haven’t been treated very well and we have had the prospect of further approved supplier work dangled in front of us a few times.
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[FONT=&quot]Today our staff member has attended to find that whilst we have been away (closed). The hotel staff have been using the machinery, our stock and equipment to serve others.
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[FONT=&quot]Effectively selling product without us knowing anything at all.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]The reason we know is that the machines have been misused and maybe damaged, we also have no stock to do our work (that they wanted us to do) this evening.
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[FONT=&quot]Now I’m stuck, do I remove everything and send in our invoice for the stock, maybe the damage if need be and the work already completed?
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[FONT=&quot]Or do we carry on for the last couple of days and keep good the relationship, with a hope that we can become an approved supplier and work for their clients.
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[FONT=&quot]I’m really stuck with what to do, because they are a big hotel chain, and we could use some work from them, likewise we may need to work in their venue in future.
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[FONT=&quot]I just feel really offended by what has happened, not only was it dangerous for all involved, but rude.
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[FONT=&quot]Thanks in advance. [/FONT]

matt-comparison

It's more a philosophical question what you're asking here. I am doubtful many people could address this matter in an impartial way and take a clear stance on yes or no. It's a complex situation with so many variables. We know nothing about your business, past success, ways forward, financing, competitors, and so on...

What I would personally suggest is that once one's integrity has been compromised, and there are negative feelings involve, relationships (businesses included) are bound for failure. Like I said I don't know your particular situation in whole.

patanne

Will you trust them in the future not to use your product without permission? Will you believe them when they say - well just about anything really? Once a relationship of whatever nature has broken down it is extremely difficult to fix it and only you can say if this IS fixable. Would you be on here asking if you weren't sure that it was over and you have zero trust in them. Why not try seeing if they pay the bill for what they have done. If they do then there may be a way forward.

Mistral001

I would leave it a few days before I see your solicitors. Anything that they can do to help you will probably take months if not years and will probably cost you a lot of money. It could probably be sorted out by some straight talking to the hotel.


BTW, if you are worried about not getting work from the hotel again, then do not even bother to talk to them as you will be talking to them from a position of weakness.

Savvy_Sue

And what did the contract for providing the food stands say? What security do you have for the stock and the equipment? What instructions are there, eg 'no unauthorised use' / 'only to be used by staff employed by assj catering'?

trailingspouse

[FONT=&quot]Or do we carry on for the last couple of days and keep good the relationship, with a hope that we can become an approved supplier and work for their clients.
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[FONT=&quot]What relationship?

[FONT=&quot]Other hotels are available - I would move on as [FONT=&quot]you obviously don't trust them and (judging by the fact they [FONT=&quot]blamed[FONT=&quot] you for the damage) they don't trust you.[/FONT][/FONT][/FONT][/FONT]
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paddyrg

There are a few issues combined here, be careful not to mix them up and handle them one by one.

1) alleged damage - you disagree but for peace you've done some subsidised gigs for them *call it quits*
2) leaving kit and stock unprotected on premises - that was an error
3) them using your kit - poor form, but if a punter asked for one of (product) a staff member may not have known whose was what and so tried to help a customer. Proving anything will be a nightmare, so if nothing is broken be grateful! The insurance position of anyone who injured themselves would be grey at best.
4) them using your stock - as above, but it may have been for punters, may have been staff shrinkage, especially at this time of year with so many casuals. Again, hard to prove, but certainly wrong.

Try talking to the hotel manager and get it straight and clear. Agree that any liability for damage is entirely zeroed. Agree what happens if you leave kit onsite (cannot be used by punters or staff for insurance reasons). Take all stock offsite every single time. Adapt the equipment to require a key - electrically or shuttered or whatever. Agree to try again or not with the hotel. Their 'trade contacts' seem to have been pretty lame so far, so it's not a great loss by the sounds, and start the new year with a professional approach, very clear hire agreements, waivers, etc. In fact if you're going to spend money with lawyers, make sure it's this - to get professional terms drawn up - and probably write off the hotel issue as unless you've direct evidence and can pin it on specific individuals, you'll have the devil's own job chasing small change.

jjlandlord

It may not be necessary to pin it on a specific individual: Whilst the equipment and stock was in effect in custody of the hotel they had a duty of care.
However it may be difficult to prove that anything went missing or was damaged.
Solicitor letters might prompt them to offer a good will payment.

bris

You need to think with you business head, how much have you lost or think you can get from them, if they are willing to pay that is and it is a big if, they will deny everything most likely.


On the other side how much business will you get by letting it slide. Some battles are not worth fighting, don't take it personally, treat it like it is, a business expense.

Savvy_Sue

paddyrg wrote: »

In fact if you're going to spend money with lawyers, make sure it's this - to get professional terms drawn up - and probably write off the hotel issue as unless you've direct evidence and can pin it on specific individuals, you'll have the devil's own job chasing small change.

Excellent advice from paddy, but this is probably the best bit, I think we asked similar questions about your contract / terms and conditions when the original issue arose ...

bris wrote: »

On the other side how much business will you get by letting it slide.

And do you want it? This is your second set of problems with this venue, at what point do you say 'enough' and move on?

[Deleted User]

Thanks guys, just read all the responses.


We emailed them and asked them to respond to what had happened. We also asked them for assurances regarding usage and the safety of our equipment.

We were using a locked cupboard on site, but of course that was their cupboard with their access.


We have a number of other props on hire at the venue, free of charge!


So I have planned to invoice them as normal (for the agreed services). We didn't return to complete the final two nights as nobody could be bothered to call us back or reply to emails.


We know the emails were received because one of the junior managers told the staff members on site (the day I emailed) what was included within the email.


It's really disappointing I suppose we are too trusting and need to improve procedures greatly. That's the next challenge.


Thanks again all :-)