How not to join a motorway!

redux

I've seen the mirror image of this happen, a car overtaking a lorry normally but pulling in much too early. Also on the M25.

The lorry driver did the same as in this, gently came to a halt on the hard shoulder.

I and presumably all the other adjacent people figured nobody was hurt and they would hardly need any witnesses, so nobody else stopped, just a check in the mirror and see the car driver getting out.

Captaincodpiece

Avoriaz wrote: »

That would be a very dumb "crash for cash".

The chances of serious injury or death were quite high for the car driver and any passengers.

Typical Daily Fail shoddy journalism.

I don't read the fail, probably for the same reasons as yourself.

I said it looked like a set up when I first saw it and they reported it as such in May this year.

I do t see how it's shoddy journalism by highlighting the lengths these criminals will go to. If the fail were to report criminal nicking live cable from train lines would you think that shoddy?

Joe_Horner

Nodding_Donkey wrote: »

I can't believe the people that are putting any percentage of blame on the lorry driver.

The car failed to give way, how can it be anything other than his fault?

Without knowing what the lorry driver's overall view was there's no way to say. But....

Given the speed differential, there's a very good chance that the lorry driver will have had a chance to see the car in his n/s mirror, disappearing into his blind spot. He should also have been aware that the slip lane was closing and that the car would have to go somewhere.

In that case, prudence (as opposed to legal requirement) says to re-aquire sight of the car asap, certainly before the lane ends, even if that means easing up slightly. Just assuming the car will cross the chevorns when you can't see it anymore is taking an unneccessary gamble.

Note: before anyone says "he might not have been visible at all", that's based on the assumption that the car could be seen when it was further back. It probably could be because it was significantly faster and lorries do have much better mirrors than cars. Intentionally checking that side as you pass a slip road should be automatic, in case there's a loon joining. I suspect the lorry driver didn't.

wba31

Captaincodpiece wrote: »

They'll be the Honda Civic drivers.

please don't tar us all with the same brush. it was a dumb move by the civic driver, if it were me i would have been picking a gap while coming down the slip road and adjusting speed appropriately to avoid making any driver already on the road adjust their speed. I would have been indicating, i would have looked over my shoulder.

100% car driver fault, by a poster who has owned 2 honda civics...

[Deleted User]

Surly nobody has a right to just enter the motorway, if the car that is in the inside lane cannot go out because of a car/ lorry beside them then the one entering must give way not enter regardless

atrixblue.-MFR-.

Joe_Horner wrote: »

Without knowing what the lorry driver's overall view was there's no way to say. But....

Given the speed differential, there's a very good chance that the lorry driver will have had a chance to see the car in his n/s mirror, disappearing into his blind spot. He should also have been aware that the slip lane was closing and that the car would have to go somewhere.

In that case, prudence (as opposed to legal requirement) says to re-aquire sight of the car asap, certainly before the lane ends, even if that means easing up slightly. Just assuming the car will cross the chevorns when you can't see it anymore is taking an unneccessary gamble.

Note: before anyone says "he might not have been visible at all", that's based on the assumption that the car could be seen when it was further back. It probably could be because it was significantly faster and lorries do have much better mirrors than cars. Intentionally checking that side as you pass a slip road should be automatic, in case there's a loon joining. I suspect the lorry driver didn't.

Perhaps the lorry couldn't move into lane 2 because he had a vehicle close to him in that lane, and a lorry up his backside we wont know as no evidence to suggest otherwise like you said.


all I know is when I was taught to drive is that slip lanes should be treated like junctions in the event there is no space to merge in lane, that the onus is on the vehicle on the slip road to give way to moving flowing traffic on the motorway when there is no space to merge onto it to constantly be aware and check blind spots mirrors and windows all around the vehicle not just to the right and to stop before the slip road ends if you cannot move, not the best course of action to take but its the safest by stopping at the end of the slip road.


it is not the lorry drivers fault, taking evasive action could have caused carnage and fatality, if he suddenly braked hard he was risk of jackknifing the trailer across all lanes, had he slowed down significantly on approach to the slip road to be cautious of this vehicle may have resulted in a rear ender, I applaud the actions of the lorry driver, he didn't panick and slam on anchors, he kept his head and controlled the situation by slowly pulling into the hardshoulder taking the vehicle on the front over with him had he acted differently I'm sure the result would have been different, had he slammed anchor he would have lost control, the vehicle would slip out from the front of the cab and be left in the carriage way for more vehicles to plough into it and him. MR lorry driver gets a :T from me.

aileth

Definitely the driver's fault, should've sped up to fit in the gap or depending on what was behind the lorry slow down and go behind. It's the car driver's obligation when joining from a slip road to safely join the traffic, not for the traffic to allow the driver to join.

When proper, it's polite to perhaps move over or change your speed to assist the traffic from the sliproad to join safer. However, there's plenty of times when this isn't possible.

There's been many a time where we've been doing 65-70 in the left lane, traffic is joining from the slip road, there's a steady stream in the middle lane going faster than us, either no gaps or don't want to disrupt their flow, so we carry on as normal. We've been honked, flashed, or had really near misses simply because the joining traffic has felt entitled and that it's our duty to give them a space.

Gavin83

anotherbaldrick wrote: »

Refer to previous thread about looking over your shoulder when entering from a slip road, without doing this you cannot be sure you do not have a blind spot with a bloody great HGV hiding in it.

If you have a blind spot big enough to hide a HGV you need to adjust your mirrors. The only vehicle that fits into my blind spot is a motorbike, enough a small car I can see at any point without having to turn my head.

colino wrote: »

Funny that anyone can view this as anything other than a crash for cash. What was the poor car driver meant to do? He could either choose to drive under the wheels of an LGV/slow down/accelerate into space/veer left to that open expanse of tarmac.

Literally anything else but what he did. At the end of the day the worst case scenario is to hit that lorry, which is what he did. Anything else would have been preferable. He could have sped into the gap or dropped back behind the lorry. Had I found myself in his position I'd have even cut across the chevron into the empty lane next to him, that would have been better.

He's actually lucky to walk away from that, the car could have potentially rolled and ended up under the lorry.

I actually know someone this happened to, although in their case it was the HGV which changed lanes and not them. They too didn't roll but it's always possible.

colino

Clearly irony is wasted here.

tbourner

Joe_Horner wrote: »

Without knowing what the lorry driver's overall view was there's no way to say. But....

Given the speed differential, there's a very good chance that the lorry driver will have had a chance to see the car in his n/s mirror, disappearing into his blind spot. He should also have been aware that the slip lane was closing and that the car would have to go somewhere.

In that case, prudence (as opposed to legal requirement) says to re-aquire sight of the car asap, certainly before the lane ends, even if that means easing up slightly. Just assuming the car will cross the chevorns when you can't see it anymore is taking an unneccessary gamble.

That's just nonsense. If you were driving down a main road with a car approaching the junction from a side road, you wouldn't take any action, you would assume the driver will stop and give way or otherwise pull onto the main road without causing a problem - you would only "deal" with the situation in the event of the driver doing something stupid like pulling out in front of you and stopping.

That stupid situation occurred in the vid; the lorry driver then dealt with the situation - up until that stupid move all he had to do was assume the driver of the car would make the appropriate avoiding action.

[NB: the above comments do not relate to motorcycles, who have to always assume stupid manoeuvres and take pre-emptive avoiding action whenever possible, even when you have right of way]