BMW - The Ultimate Driving Delusion?

motorguy

UsernameAlreadyExists wrote: »

A Lexus LFA perhaps?

The clue is in the name there - not a toyota.

andygb

darkmatter101 wrote: »

Not entirely true, I'm sure a lot of drivers who are new to rear wheel drive would be quite frightened if they pushed a BMW in the wet (especially the older e36). I have seen countless BMW's spin and crash in roundabouts and sharp turns.

BMW's are deceptively quick, in that you feel like you're doing 50mph but glance at the speed dial and actually realise you're going 80. That can be quite dangerous for drivers who aren't use to powerful cars which are also refined and smooth (probably the extra sound deadening).

I think sometimes BMW take their whole motto on being 'the ultimate driving machine' a bit too seriously. They even started selling their own 'BMW Performance' parts, no other car manufacturer as far as I'm aware does that. They realised from the E36's that they have to make their cars more soft and road friendly rather than sporty. If anyone has driven the E36 that was quite a 'raw' car for what was suppose to be a 'luxury' car.

I have owned three Beemers, including the little classic coupe from the early seventies. The second one I owned was an E28 1982 528i, and it was a superb long distance cruiser, as well as being very brisk when required. It could also bite you if you were careless, which I found out about a couple of times in the wet and snow. The six cylinder engine was a masterpiece, smooth and quiet, but with enough melodic noise when roused.
The problem with Beemers, is that people associate them with "Yuppies" and bankers, boys in the city who want to be flash, and there is more to them than that.
On the downside, the noise and ride on less than perfect roads is often poor, because of the large tyres, and spare parts are expensive.
I totally agree with the lack of perception of speed in a Beemer, but that only makes a less skillful driver more vulnerable to making mistakes as incidents happen more quickly.

motorguy

TrickyWicky wrote: »

BMW? well apart from the badge, what really is there to them?

I know a french model that is better than many of them - i should know, i had a beemer driver in one once and he was utterly gutted at how rubbish his babe magnet was compared to it.

So summarising, your mate had some old BMW that he thought was a babe magnet, you had a french car and he seemed to like it, therefore all BMWs are crap?

Brilliant.

motorguy

Prothet_of_Doom wrote: »

Some years ago I coined the phrase, "Any numpty can drive fast in a fast car, but it takes real skill, a lack of mechanical sympathy, and bravery to drive fast in a slow car"

You coined the phrase?

Wow, hats off. I thought that phrase was just common sense. I didnt think anyone had taken the time to sit down and think it up.

Respect!

motorguy

UsernameAlreadyExists wrote: »

No, you're right. You have the best car in the entire world. It excels at everything. Can it beat an AMG A45?

Not really comparing like with like - a v8 coupe to a 4 cyl 5 door hatch.

Each will have their merits. Not sure i'd want to spend £40K on a 4 pot hatch though.

motorguy

Mr_Mink wrote: »

I suspect you haven't been in a modern city car have you? My Up does a 52 mile round trip to work each day, about a third of that is dual carriageway, during which time the car is quiet since my car has this incredible concept of a longer gear ratio so it sits at a shade over 3k revs which is perfectly quiet (and before you say it, I'm sure your car can do 2k revs in 6th gear at 70 mph bla bla bla, but 3k hasn't deafened me yet).

I also have yet to be blown into the surrounding countryside by another car whizzing by me. To be honest, I have only been buffeted by extremely strong winds which would have blown any car about.

And whilst I haven't tested it, it has been mentioned previously that the car has a 5 star Euro ncap rating so it's perfectly safe too.

I also have more room inside than my mate's 1 series (bar the boot) .

The clue is in the name with the likes of the Skoda Citigo. They're designed as citycars, though obviously that doesnt mean they cant be driven on motorways, just that they're not ideal for it.

Wouldnt be my steed of choice for regular long runs but each to their own.

motorguy

Strider590 wrote: »

I think it's psychological...... Much like a placebo.

People think they're better, so they seem better.

I think that some of BMWs cars are exceptional cars. Clearly they use that "halo" effect to sell the entry level cars.

I dont think anyone really buys a 316d or a 114d because its the "ultimate driving machine".

However it does seem to suit some people to project that reason onto BMW drivers - "oh they've bought that because they've been conned into thinking its the Ultimate Driving Machine". No, they bought it because they like the car.

Its a bit like the "i dont finance a BMW because i'm a better man for buying my Vauxhall Vectra for cash".

Strider590 wrote: »

Personally the last one I was in, I found shocking, a Z4, the dash was plastic fantastic, felt like it was going to fall apart, worse than an old Subaru.

Wifie has had a z4 3.0 Si Coupe and currently has the new type 2.0i Turbo with the folding metal roof.

In between she had a Prodrive modded Subaru Impreza

I can assure you that even the latest subarus are a mile behind the z4s in terms of plastic quality, and no trim has ever rattled off either (hard driven) z4.

Strider590 wrote: »

BUT people see past this stuff because they've been brainwashed by socially derived opinions.

Yes. Exactly. People like you are brainwashed into thinking BMW drivers are sheep who only buy the cars because they're too dumb to see the real truth, when the "real truth" is that generally they're buying a decent premium brand car.

Strider590 wrote: »

These "prestige" brands just play at massaging peoples egos and that's why so many incompetent drivers buy these things.

I think you will find incompetent drivers buy all sorts of cars.

Strider590 wrote: »

By my definition, the ultimate driving machine is something that neither interferes with OR helps the driver, no radio, no aircon and doesn't carry shopping, a car which on the limit steers with the throttle instead of the steering wheel. A road legal racing car fits that description and that's exactly what I have in my garage.

You do realise its just a marketing slogan dont you and you're not really supposed to take it literally?

In the same way as these are not to be taken literally :-

• "Mercedes-Benz. The Future of the Automobile."
• "Honda. The Power of Dreams"
• "Alfa Romeo. Beauty is not enough."
• "Peugeot. Live the pleasure."
• "Toyota. Who could ask for anything more?"
• "You can with a Nissan"
• "Just imagine what Citroen can do for you."

motorguy

UsernameAlreadyExists wrote: »

Lexus = Toyata. Only named differently for snob value, which is perfect for this thread

Yeah you're right. The Lexus LFA is very similar to the Yaris.

They've both got a wheel at each corner for example.

motorguy

Strider590 wrote: »

I don't enjoy driving, at least not on the daily commute, too many f**kwits about, too much road rage, too many plastic policemen, too many vigilantes, too many egos. Then there's the roads, covered in lose stones and pot holes, my everyday car is covered in scratches, dents and stone chips, it's had 2 new windscreens in 4 years.

Why would I want to subject a "nice car" to that sort of crap?
Why spend that sort of money on something which other people make sure you can't enjoy?

I'd much rather a weekend car that I can take out at 5am (when all the incompetent tin-top drivers/cagers are is still in bed) and actually enjoy properly.

So if im going to have a 2nd car, then why does it need to do anything that my every day car does?

This ^^ is why I just don't see the point in having these "prestige" motors, they're just a compromise.

Again, having a weekend kit car suits YOU.

What if, like the majority of people, you just want one car? Is it wrong to want something a bit nice? Or should we all just give up?

GabbaGabbaHey

motorguy wrote: »

Wifie has had a z4 3.0 Si Coupe and currently has the new type 2.0i Turbo with the folding metal roof.

In between she had a Prodrive modded Subaru Impreza

I can assure you that even the latest subarus are a mile behind the z4s in terms of plastic quality, and no trim has ever rattled off either (hard driven) z4.

Totally agree. I have a Z4M Roadster, and my wife used to have an Impreza Turbo.

The Impreza was a very fast car, but in terms of build quality it was on a different planet to the BMW.