No Gas Supplier

Anon_Ominous

I am aware that similar threads have existed on this forum but I feel that my situation may be slightly different to those of previous posters.

I moved into a flat, which I am privately renting, about a month ago. I contacted western power distribution to find out who my electricity supplier is and I have set up an account with them for my electricity bills.

However, when I phoned the Meter Number Helpline (which I belive has something to do with the national grid) they were unable to tell me who my gas supplier is and did not give me a Meter Point Reference Number.

Their advice was to just choose a supplier and ask them to start billing me.

The flat has a gas supply and I have not had any trouble using the gas hob or gas boiler bur it appears that nobody is charging me for it.

The flats were built about 5 years ago and I know there is at least one previous occupant.

I asked the agent on the meter number helpline what would happen if I did not ask a supplier to start charging me for gas? Her response was, "I honestly could not answer that."

I have read forum posts about people moving into new builds or switching to gas from other fuels and going years without being billed for it.

Whilst I am aware that it would not be the most honest thing to do, it seems to me that hypothetically I could keep this ommission to myself and enjoy free gas until the end of my tenancy.

Of course if I would prefer not to pay for gas if i dont have to and I do not feel morally compelled to volunteer my hard earned money to some multi billion profit making company for the trouble of typing my details into their system and sending me a letter a few times per year.

I have also read that it can be quite difficult to actually get set up with a gas supplier anyway if they cannot trace the previous supplier.

Naturally, my concern would be where I would stand legally?

Do I have any responsibility to endeavour to ensure that I am being billed for gas? Or would the blame be with national grid or whichever incompetent person/company didn't do their job correctly to begin with?

Any advice would be very much appreciated.

[Deleted User]

Yes you do have a responsibility to pay for your gas, and please take the advice given you from National Grid. British Gas, as the biggest gas producer in the UK are probably paying for your gas you are consuming so I suggest you ring their customer services and set up an account. This is yet another plus factor for smart meters as they would be in prepay mode for all vacant properties to begin with forcing people to be honest and upfront.This sort of thing is rife in the UK , that is people moving into rentals and by one way or another they decline to pay a penny for their energy.Theres another one on here ( coincidentally ! ) just a few days ago whos managed to get to 8 years free electric and now a meter reader has visited, he/she is searching for info how to avoid paying his/her dues. He/she would ve gone on indefinitely I would have thought if a meter reader had nt had visited.
A police officer once told me that if I found a £20 note in the street I was breaking the law if I kept it. I was to hand it in to the police station and await a certain time before I could lay claim to it. I once found a wallet with £200 in it and returned it to the owner before he knew he d lost it. I consider myself honest enough not to take whats not mine even if there is little chance of being caught. I cant see the difference in you taking money in the form of gas and and not paying for it, after all someone else has paid for it.

Anon_Ominous

You clearly work for British Gas.

I am sorry if I have offended you but I was looking for slightly more impartial advice.

I certainly would not chose British Gas as my research has shown me that some of their competitors would be much cheaper.

Would they even be able to take over the supply since there is no reference number for the meter and no previous supplier? I know that others have had difficulties in this regard.

[Deleted User]

Anon_Ominous wrote: »

You clearly work for British Gas.

I am sorry if I have offended you but I was looking for slightly more impartial advice.

I certainly would not chose British Gas as my research has shown me that some of their competitors would be much cheaper.

Would they even be able to take over the supply since there is no reference number for the meter and no previous supplier? I know that others have had difficulties in this regard.

I work for 3 of the big 6, I m not a big BG fan, and I dont have them supply me because as you say they re not the cheapest. They are the best organised and come top of the customer service table so you wont be waiting more than a minute or two if you decide to ring them. They are the main producers of gas and its them who will be picking up the tab for your non payments IF you stay as you are.
As to the legalities of it if you stay as you are. We find people criminally bypassing the meters all the time and nothing is ever done except they are asked to repay what they have thieved. No deterrents are around now so thats why energy theft is on the increase. Actual prosecutions for energy theft seems to be non existent so your risk is only a payback OR like the other fellow (who has nt paid a penny for 8 years) argue the toss and only get backbilled for a year. I hope he gets the full six years.
You definitely have`nt offended me, I m an old cynic and have been watching people get away with murder thieving gas/electricity for years and it does nt upset me. I d like to see it stopped tho

Anon_Ominous

IF you are implying that I am a thief then I resent that implication.

You may not have noticed the big red badge next to my posts but I do not feel that you are being 'especially nice'.

I have not, nor do intend to conduct any criminal activity and I do not believe that the meter has been criminally bypassed. I do however believe that somebody else has not done their job properly and I do not want to be held responsible for that. Hence, I have come here for some advice.

[Deleted User]

Anon_Ominous wrote: »

IF you are implying that I am a thief then I resent that implication.

You may not have noticed the big red badge next to my posts but I do not feel that you are being 'especially nice'.

I have not, nor do intend to conduct any criminal activity and I do not believe that the meter has been criminally bypassed. I do however believe that somebody else has not done their job properly and I do not want to be held responsible for that. Hence, I have come here for some advice.

No..no allegations at all of you being a thief, thats reserved for the vast numbers of illegal bypassers we have now. You wanted to know the legalities of NOT declaring that you are receiving un paid for gas on a credit gas meter. The outcome of you continuing as you are will be the same as the bloke a few posts back, if and when it comes to light, and it will, you will have either vacated or you will face a little battle of the backbilling code with British Gas or whoever was the original supplier to the property.
Heres some advice from me. Phone British Gas tomorrow , then switch 4 to 6 weeks later. I dont have to be nice to newbies, this is not first day at school is it ?

Nada666

Anon_Ominous wrote:

IF you are implying that I am a thief then I resent that implication.

It is not so much an implication by another. It is more a self-declared quack and a walk:

Anon_Ominous wrote: »

Of course if I would prefer not to pay for gas if i dont have to and I do not feel morally compelled to volunteer my hard earned money to some multi billion profit making company for the trouble of typing my details into their system and sending me a letter a few times per year.

tripled

It is possible your meter isn't on record. However given it's a fairly recent development I'd say it's more likely that either the meter was put in by an independent pipeline company (which don't all bother reporting to the national database) or they still hold plot details (which would make it hard to find unless you supplied the meter serial number when you called them).

If you haven't already, I'd recommend taking a good look at your gas meter. It may tell you on there which company fitted it, or might even have your Meter Point Reference Number on it (from which you can also work out which pipeline company fitted it). Also take down the meter serial number.

If that tells you the pipeline company that fitted the meter or provides you with the MPRN then you can find out your supplier (just ask for further advice if needed). If that information isn't there and you didn't give the Meter Number Helpline the serial number, give them another call with that information.

If the above still hasn't got you anywhere, I'd keep that information safe, take regular meter readings so you can calculate how much your using and put the money to cover it to one side. It's probable you'll hear off someone sooner or later and could have a sizeable bill to pay, however you might get lucky. Remember this could come back a few years down the line.

As an aside, BG doesn't pick up the tab by themselves for your gas if you genuinly don't have a supplier (aka "shipperless"). There's a system of balancing in place which means that various parties contribute to unmetered losses from the network (leaks, stolen gas, etc.) - although as the biggest supplier they would pick up a bigger proportion of the bill.

Edit: To answer your direct question, then provided you don't do anything fraudulant (e.g. bypass the meter or provide false information) then I don't believe you'd be comitting any criminal offence. However that doesn't mean you wouldn't be liable for payment if they caught up with you. I'm no lawyer though.

Anon_Ominous

Thanks tripled. That's very helpful.

Andy_WSM

Anon_Ominous wrote: »

IF you are implying that I am a thief then I resent that implication.

I'll go as far as calling you a thief. You are knowingly taking what isn't yours. That's stealing. It may not be "especially nice", but hey, guess what, I'm fed up of being told we must pander to people nowadays and be "PC" about everything.

thief
θiːf/
noun
noun: thief; plural noun: thieves
a person who steals another person's property, especially by stealth and without using force or threat of violence.

jbainbridge

At the very least it would be wise to stash some money away each month to cover the possible bill. If you can get it resolved you can then switch to a (cheaper) supplier of your choice.

I assume you have taken an entry meter reading - you certainly only want to be paying for gas _you_ have used!