DVLA right or wrong?

TrickyWicky

perjubs wrote: »

I work as a security guard on a private site, to enter you need to go through an electronic barrier, though anyone from the public can come onto the site to visit a car spares shop, the rest of the site is used by logistics firms.

If people have to go through a barrier to gain access which must be authorised by yourself then NO the DVLA have no right of access and it is NOT a public car park.

A public car park is one where the right of entry is IMPLIED - IE unrestricted. You have a restriction in place and thus a right of entry IS NOT IMPLIED.

By letting the DVLA in however, you have implied that they may enter so you will have to inform them the next time they come that you have revoked their implied right of access and that it is not a public car park but a private facility for those with an interest in being there.

In short, tell them to s*d off.

DUTR

TrickyWicky wrote: »

If people have to go through a barrier to gain access which must be authorised by yourself then NO the DVLA have no right of access and it is NOT a public car park.

A public car park is one where the right of entry is IMPLIED - IE unrestricted. You have a restriction in place and thus a right of entry IS NOT IMPLIED.

By letting the DVLA in however, you have implied that they may enter so you will have to inform them the next time they come that you have revoked their implied right of access and that it is not a public car park but a private facility for those with an interest in being there.

In short, tell them to s*d off.

As we are not the ones facing the agent, then it's easy to sit back and offer what we may or may not do.
The DVLA are agents of the goverment and there is a proceedure that the OP's friend can follow if they believe they have been hard done by.

sh0597

I'd do what my boss told me to do which you said is not let them in.

TrickyWicky

Paperbird wrote: »

It's private land so as long as it is not maintained by the council a SORNed car can be kept there. Public access has nothing to do with it.

Actually it does. You need to lookup the highways act and the road traffic act. Land that the public has an implied right of access to (eg a supermarket car park) is legally covered as part of a public highway and thus has to be taxed, insured and MOT'd.

Your arguement is a bit like saying if the wheels aren't on the yellow lines then its not breaking parking rules and the ticket is invalid. Again the RTA covers this and the yellows only indicate a parking restriction (which on a technical note is "Parked in a restricted street during prescribed hours" and actually says nothing about any vehicle being parked on yellows.

The same principle applies here, just because a car park isn't owned by the state of one of the councils does not mean the DVLA have no right of inspection - if its covered as part of a highway due to an implied right of access to the public then the DVLA can and will inspect it.

This site however is different, the op has stated that he has control of a barrier which is in place to prevent unwanted people entering the site. This means that there is not an implied right of access but a restricted form of access - eg only those that the site decides to permit entry can enter it and therefore it is not part of the public highway.

Nilrem

Paperbird wrote: »

It's private land so as long as it is not maintained by the council a SORNed car can be kept there. Public access has nothing to do with it.
I don't know if you can deny him access but a phonecall to the local pound that he will be working from pointing out it is private land and not public highway or council adopted land should get him sent back to remove the clamp.

Public access has everything to do with a lot of motoring offences.

IIRC last year (or 2010-12) a motorbike owner, whose bike was SORN'd but on a bit of private land next to a pavement got done and it went all the way through the courts.

With many RTA offences the "public" part refers to anywhere the public have access to, that can include a farmers field on days when the public might be at an event at one end, but not the next day when the public have no access (and that has been through the courts a few times for things like farmers family members being done for no licence/insurance when moving vehicles on such days).
It also gets/got a lot of people who used to muck around in supermarket car parks (which again are privately owned, but the public have access to).


In the op's case I suspect it could be either way, as although people have access to the area at request, it's not "open" access.

Rover_Driver

Nilrem wrote: »

Public access has everything to do with a lot of motoring offences.

But nothing to do with Vehicle Excise offences.

atrixblue.-MFR-.

Tell DVLA to do one and turn them away. when it comes to legality arguments, tell them to write to your boss as your under instruction NOT TO ALLOW DVLA onsite. if they wish to call police let them, tell them to move away form the entrance gate though not to obstruct await the police arrival and say my boss doesn't want them on his land the land is restricted to employee's and those who wish to use the parts shop and logistics vehicles who have to be stopped at the gate and stipulate where they wish to go.

Aretnap

TrickyWicky wrote: »

Actually it does. You need to lookup the highways act and the road traffic act. Land that the public has an implied right of access to (eg a supermarket car park) is legally covered as part of a public highway and thus has to be taxed, insured and MOT'd.

You're sort of correct as far as insurance (required in any place to which the public have access) and MOT (required on any road to which the public have access) go, but not about tax. Tax has nothing to do with either the Road Traffic Act or the Highways Act - it comes under the Vehicle Excise and Registration Act, for the purposes of which a public road is defined as "in England and Wales and Northern Ireland... a road which is repairable at the public expense".

It's quite legal to keep a SORNed, untaxed vehicle in a place with public access, so long as it's not maintained at public expense, and so long as any relevant boxes relating to insurance and MOT are ticked.

System

Rover_Driver wrote: »

But nothing to do with Vehicle Excise offences.

Public Access has.
See http://audisrs.com/archive/dvla-clamping-on-private-property__o_t__t_19632.html this sheds a different light on it.

It is a public access area because although they may say they are intending to visit the car shop it is completely open and they are free to go where they wish without let or hindrance so have full access to all parts of the site.

If DVLA class this as public then clamping a SORN'd vehicle would be legitimate. It is up to the car owner to argue the point with DVLA.

JustinR1979

Just tell him to jog on, and to contact your boss or the police if he has a problem.
Not worth losing your job over.