Legality of having two jobs (at the same time).

NoNoDrama

Been offered a new job but nervous about leaving my current job in case of my new job turns out to be a nightmare.

I was planning on going long-term sick with my current employer (stressful situation to be fair) whilst starting this new job for a trial period. Thinking being if this new job turns out to be a bad I got the comfort of going back to my old job.

Yes morally it's a bit naughty as I'll be getting paid from both employers, the employer I'm leaving being the one that wouldn't be the most happy of course.

I'd only need 2 weeks or so to gauge whether this new job is for me, so i'll get a sick note from doc covering the two weeks.

References? Not a problem it's a massive company with an out-sourced HR department so my direct manager will be none the wiser when new company approaches for a reference.

Would I be breaking any law by doing this? Thanks.

DomRavioli

You would need to seek professional legal advice - I would advise completely against doing anything of such a nature as it is wholly unethical, and what will your prospective employer think when they find out what you've done? If I were your manager and I found out you'd done that, you'd be sacked.

Morally, it is seriously messed up.

You could be sacked from both as you are not sick (committing fraud), and any sick note handed in could constitute fraud as well as gross misconduct from both roles, resulting in instant dismissal.

They may also put down that you're currently on sick leave on any reference and the dates of such, and having worked at the new job for less than 2 years they can sack you without reason.

It is just an absolutely stupid idea - it can, and will probably lead to you losing both jobs.

elsien

^^^^^^
What he said.

NoNoDrama

DomRavioli wrote: »

You would need to seek professional legal advice - I would advise completely against doing anything of such a nature as it is wholly unethical, and what will your prospective employer think when they find out what you've done? If I were your manager and I found out you'd done that, you'd be sacked.

Morally, it is seriously messed up.

You could be sacked from both as you are not sick (committing fraud), and any sick note handed in could constitute fraud as well as gross misconduct from both roles, resulting in instant dismissal.

They may also put down that you're currently on sick leave on any reference and the dates of such, and having worked at the new job for less than 2 years they can sack you without reason.

It is just an absolutely stupid idea - it can, and will probably lead to you losing both jobs.

How would my new company find out exactly? They won't put sick leave stuff on references. (checked). Referencing will be done before I start new role. It's immoral, I can live with that.. if it's illegal I can't do that. My current employer says nothing in my contract about me not being able to have only one job...current job could be 'specific to the role work related stress' (their fault) which doesn't mean I'm not fit enough to work for someone else.

Undervalued

There are certain circumstances were it is reasonable to be off sick from one job but fit for the other.

An obvious example might be someone with two part time jobs, one manual and the other clerical. A physical injury might prevent the manual work.

However what you are proposing is quite wrong as (I assume) both jobs are full time. Even if the doctor is happy to sign you off for stress you are still employed so it would be a clear breach of contract to take on another job during the same working hours.

Annisele

If you weren't getting paid for both jobs, I think there'd be much less of an issue.

I'm not a lawyer, but I suspect old employer might say something like:

• NoNoDrama said they were sick;
• So we paid them in reliance on their statement;
• If we'd known they weren't sick, we wouldn't have paid them;
• So NoNoDrama misled us into paying money we wouldn't otherwise have paid.

I don't know if that meets the technical definition of fraud, but if it doesn't it should.

Are you certain your old employer won't find out? Being asked for a reference for somebody who then goes off sick is something of a red flag. The fact HR is outsourced doesn't necessarily mean your manager won't be told.

NoNoDrama

Undervalued wrote: »

However what you are proposing is quite wrong as (I assume) both jobs are full time. Even if the doctor is happy to sign you off for stress you are still employed so it would be a clear breach of contract to take on another job during the same working hours.

"breach of contract" yes terrible stuff etc etc but I wouldn't actually be breaking any laws, unless someone can tell me otherwise.

I personally think it's a very savy idea. I get the moral outrage, but sometimes you have to look after yourself.

The main problem would be a P45 issues. (p45 2 weeks late and possibly having to explain the late leaving date on P45 to new employer))

TELLIT01

Do you have any holiday available? If so I would take that and go to the other employer for that period. You have already mentioned the potential pitfalls of your other route and if I was the new employer you would be straight back out through the door if I discovered what you had done. That is if you tried pulling the sicky option.

NoNoDrama

Annisele wrote: »

Are you certain your old employer won't find out? Being asked for a reference for somebody who then goes off sick is something of a red flag. The fact HR is outsourced doesn't necessarily mean your manager won't be told.

Unlikely it would go back to them, even if it did they wouldn't know the start date, I could say it is a false approach and have no intention of taking the job etc

Have holiday but won't get the time off. Not an option unfortunately.

Undervalued

NoNoDrama wrote: »

but I wouldn't actually be breaking any laws, unless someone can tell me otherwise.

Yes you would if your "sickness" is faked!

The fact that a doctor may have signed a certificate is a "professional opinion" no more. If you were charged with fraud then it would be no more that one piece of evidence on your side. The jury may find the prosecution's evidence more compelling!

Even if it doesn't get that far the new employer doesn't need any evidence at all to dismiss you in the first two years.

Annisele

NoNoDrama wrote: »

Unlikely it would go back to them, even if it did they wouldn't know the start date, I could say it is a false approach and have no intention of taking the job etc

So you'd lie.

It sounds to me as though your plan could possibly amount to fraud by false representation - but as I say, I'm not a lawyer.

The moral outrage you're so dismissive of could yet come back to bite you. If your manager finds out, and calls your new manager, you could well find yourself without either job.

In the industry I work in your old manager would find out, because somebody in your new firm would gossip in the pub to somebody who still works for the old one. You may well work in a larger industry with more competitors, but it sounds a very stupid idea to me.