Overtaking on a hatched area

MARKA

That's the spot and that's what happened exactly as you described it

matttye

MARKA wrote: »

That's the spot and that's what happened exactly as you described it

Did your son get details of any independent witnesses? Maybe the driver who turned left?

nobbysn*ts

matttye wrote: »

In the above link, are you saying that a car coming from the right was turning left onto Heathfield Road, and a car behind that car was overtaking by going into the hatched area to the right?

If so, I don't see how your son can be at fault. A car should never overtake in such circumstances. Not only are they going into a lane intended for people turning right when travelling in the opposite direction, but they're overtaking on approach to a junction and near a bend. Overtaking there is ridiculous if I have understood correctly.

There's only one lane and if the car turning left was blocking your son from seeing the other car, then it would appear that he made the appropriate observations but the other driver's dangerous manoeuvre caused the accident.

Also, I don't see what your son has to lose by seeking half an hour's free advice from a solicitor and asking what his chances are!

Yes, sometimes the person overtaking is a real bell end.

neilmcl

matttye wrote: »

If so, I don't see how your son can be at fault. A car should never overtake in such circumstances. Not only are they going into a lane intended for people turning right when travelling in the opposite direction, but they're overtaking on approach to a junction and near a bend. Overtaking there is ridiculous if I have understood correctly.

I don't agree that the lad was not at fault. Yes the other driver made a careless manoeuvre but that's not at issue, after all we don't what course of action the police took against him. However the OPs son still entered the the road when it wasn't clear.

Whenever a car is approaching your junction from the right with the intention of turning into your road you make sure that he actually commits to that manouvre before pulling out. If the OP's son had done so then he should have seen a car behind that one, let alone making an overtake.

matttye

neilmcl wrote: »

I don't agree that the lad was not at fault. Yes the other driver made a careless manoeuvre but that's not at issue, after all we don't what course of action the police took against him. However the OPs son still entered the the road when it wasn't clear.

Whenever a car is approaching your junction from the right with the intention of turning into your road you make sure that he actually commits to that manouvre before pulling out. If the OP's son had done so then he should have seen a car behind that one, let alone making an overtake.

The OP says that the car had already begun turning left when his son pulled out. That's in line with the highway code and also with common sense.

If he didn't see the overtaking car as his view was obstructed by the turning car, there's no reason why he shouldn't have pulled out there. If you look at the street view image, it's possible that he could have seen that there were no cars travelling behind the car turning left, but still have been unable to see the overtaking car. In such circumstances, once the car had begun to turn left and he could see that no cars were travelling behind, there was no need to wait any longer.

You don't need to wait until a car turning left is completely into the road it is entering before you pull out.

facade

matttye wrote: »

it's possible that he could have seen that there were no cars travelling behind the car turning left, but still have been unable to see the overtaking car. In such circumstances, once the car had begun to turn left and he could see that no cars were travelling behind, there was no need to wait any longer.

So as long as you couldn't see an oncoming vehicle, you are o.k. to just collide with it? :eek:

(what if it had been a nun on a bicycle, with a basket of kittens, not an oncoming car- would it still have been o.k. then?)

matttye

facade wrote: »

So as long as you couldn't see an oncoming vehicle, you are o.k. to just collide with it? :eek:

(what if it had been a nun on a bicycle, with a basket of kittens, not an oncoming car- would it still have been o.k. then?)

I didn't say that...

The car overtook in a ridiculously dangerous location.

Would you wait until a car turning left had completed its turn, or pull out when it had started to turn?

Personally I'd be pulling out as soon as I saw it had slowed down significantly for the turn...

facade

matttye wrote: »

I didn't say that...

Agreed, not in those words, but what else does

"If he didn't see the overtaking car as his view was obstructed by the turning car, there's no reason why he shouldn't have pulled out there." imply?

matttye wrote: »

The car overtook in a ridiculously dangerous location.

Still no reason not to look out for it though.

matttye wrote: »

Would you wait until a car turning left had completed its turn, or pull out when it had started to turn?

Personally I'd be pulling out as soon as I saw it had slowed down significantly for the turn...

I might pull out, provided I was certain there was nothing behind him that could drive around him- I've seen it hundreds of times, motorbikes do it all the time.


Back to the original post, the moneysaving option is do the course, much cheaper than a court appearance, and a bit more education in roadcraft never hurt anyone, and may even save money if it prevents another accident in the future.

mgdavid

londonTiger wrote: »

you can't win. Both will be found liabile. I suspect both parties were handed fines/points/awareness course and that's the end of it.

Awareness course is best solution IMO. Driver needs to be aware that they need to look and SEE before pulling out. I've had a few occasions where I had to overtake learner drivers and someone at a junction to the left did not see/expect me and they started to pull out - a few spotted me in time, others I had to beep at.

I suspect this happens a LOT with cyclists when they get "missed" by cars pulling out of juction and accident ensues.

No, you didn't HAVE to, you can always wait.
You've shown your inexperience previously, you don't seem to be learning road survival skills...

mgdavid

matttye wrote: »

I didn't say that...
The car overtook in a ridiculously dangerous location.
Would you wait until a car turning left had completed its turn, or pull out when it had started to turn?

Personally I'd be pulling out as soon as I saw it had slowed down significantly for the turn...

then you are setting yourself up for the same crash.
The smart money is on those who learn from other people's mistakes rather than letting the same thing happen to themselves.