Has the time come to transfer Dad to a Care Home

nad1611

Hi Everyone. Well we've been looking after Dad in his own home since Mum died last August, since when, Dad's Dementia has got really bad. He no longer has capacity to do anything for himself (that's not the Official verdict more our own observations), he literally needs help with everything other than transferring food to his mouth.
In the past month, he has become violent and aggressive and extremely unsettled and ended up in A&E recently having tired to get out of the house at night. He's very unsettled even when he's at home, where one would presume he'd be settled. My brother lives with Dad full time and he feels he can no longer give Dad the 24hr observation he needs. Without him there there's little the rest of us can do but accept this, my brother's done an amazing job, so it was always going to be his decision.
So here's how things are, there's no Power of Attorney, we haven't applied to the Court of Protection and I know a vsit to his GP would confirm our ideas about capacity. Dad has plenty of money to fund himself but should an assessment be done away.
I think we'll be fine in a practical sense about finding a home, obviously in an emotional sense it will be the hardest thing I think we'll ever do. We feel we've failed somehow even though I know we've done all we can.
There are some practical questions. Can you simply "put" your parent in a home, surely there's some sort of assessment done by GP/Social Worker to confirm his incapacity, before someone can be moved in this way? Would people still go ahead with the Court of Protection application and if the need for Dad to go into Care became urgent would the emergency application be applicable here?

Can't think of anything else right now,but I'm sure I'll think of some, but would be really happy if people have ay advice at what is for us a terrible time ahead. Thanks.

Torry_Quine

Firstly if your Dad goes into a home ( I hate the phrase put someone in a home) then you have not failed him in any way but are getting him the best care that he needs.
His GP should be your first port of call and as you say that you think he hasn't got capacity then if a danger to himself or others then he could be sectioned and placed in suitable care. Please be assured this is merely a way that someone who cannot look after themself can get helped.

I think that applying to the court of protection will be needed whatever happens so that someone can look after his financial interests.

Gleek

If it is judged as him having capacity by social services then, without his permission, he cannot be forced to do anything - including move into a home. If he says no at anytime, then it's a no whilst he still has capacity.

POA - you've probably left it too late now so it may be made a little harder (sorry, not a nice thing to think but it was hard enough when we went through it WITH poa) his gp and social services are def the best places to start. He needs an assessment first and foremost.

Person_one

The act you need to look at is the Mental Capacity Act. If somebody loses capacity but hasn't set up a LPA then the court of protection can appoint somebody to be a 'deputy' and make decisions in their best interests. From the sounds of it that's what you'll need to do.

Are social services or any district nurses etc aware of your dad? Is he on anybody's 'books' as it were?

This is reasonably useful: http://www.adviceguide.org.uk/england/relationships_e/relationships_looking_after_people_e/managing_affairs_for_someone_else.htm#h_who_can_make_decisions_when_someone_loses_mental_capacity_and_theres_no_power_of_attorney

Elsewhere

You are obviously very caring people. I'd suggest for your peace of mind and for your father's best interests you get Power of Attorney as soon as possible.

Otherwise Social Services are going to decide for him, and while I am sure they do their best, they don't know and understand him like you do. If I were you, I'd make sure to be in charge.

However, they can be a double edged sword. In my FIL's case we thought they were being obstructive, but given a while to think about social service's point of view (who have a huge range of experience) we saw we were being overly pessimistic about his condition and where he should be cared for - and we were glad they influenced our final decision.

Nevertheless I think it is important that the family retain overall control of assets and decisions. My husband's uncle and aunt's care (in London) ended up with the council and it was very bad.

Robinette

Definitely apply to the Court of Protection as soon as possible, as it can be a long process.


Although you say your dad has 'plenty of money', you should also find out about his fees being paid by NHS continuing care, which is not means tested. Mum was awarded continuing care when she went into a dementia care home about six years ago, saving her around £40,000 a year in fees.


If your dad does have to pay his own fees, you can buy a bond to pay his fees for the rest of his life. This is a bit of a lottery as nobody knows how long a dementia sufferer will live, but it can be a good option if there is a chance that the money would run out, enabling your dad to stay in the home of your choice.


Finally, there is lots of information on the Talking Point forum from the Alzheimer's Society.

Mr_Toad

I cared for my mother when she developed dementia. As I worked from home it was easy for me to move in with her and keep an eye on her.

As she deteriorated it became a lot more difficult and eventually impossible.

There are so many things in the home that are dangerous quite apart from getting out in the night.

In the end it made me ill through lack of sleep amongst other things. I called the Social Services emergency number and they came out the following day and arranged for Mum to go into respite care while I recovered, I was near to needing hospitalisation.

While in care they did a full assessment and she never came out. They told me what I, and you, already knew, that she needed 24 hour care and that one person can not provide it.

I already had power of attorney for Mum but it only covers the financial aspect, however, I wouldn't be too concerned about the decisions regarding your father care, they aren't monsters and in my experience they not only care what happens but will involve you and the family in all their decisions.

When I started to care for Mum I did a carers course at the Alzheimer's Society and their main message was not to let dementia ruin two, or more lives. Do what you can but get help from the outset, you can't do it all.

Someone in an earlier post said they hated the term putting someone in a home, I disagree, they do care and it is that persons home. Don't be put off by the bad publicity some care homes have been getting, they do not represent the majority which are very nice with caring staff.

I have nothing but praise for everyone involved in Mum's care from GP, Social Services, who were fantastic and treated Mum with the greatest respect, to the care home staff who are giving her a far better quality of life than one person ever could.

Seeking help isn't a sign of failure, in fact it sounds as though your father is at the stage in his illness where not seeking help would be a failure.

Good luck.

Mr_Toad

Robinette wrote: »

Definitely apply to the Court of Protection as soon as possible, as it can be a long process.


Although you say your dad has 'plenty of money', you should also find out about his fees being paid by NHS continuing care, which is not means tested. Mum was awarded continuing care when she went into a dementia care home about six years ago, saving her around £40,000 a year in fees.


If your dad does have to pay his own fees, you can buy a bond to pay his fees for the rest of his life. This is a bit of a lottery as nobody knows how long a dementia sufferer will live, but it can be a good option if there is a chance that the money would run out, enabling your dad to stay in the home of your choice.


Finally, there is lots of information on the Talking Point forum from the Alzheimer's Society.

When my father's money ran out and Social Services took over the funding, he wasn't moved, he remained in the same home until he died.

Mum is funded by Social Services, the money went on Dad's care, and she is in a fantastic home, in fact when she went in Social Services were going to get her moved to the same home as Dad as soon as there was a room but Dad died only three weeks after Mum went into the home.

People are not automatically moved to some second rate, cheaper home the moment the money runs out.

Robinette

Mr_Toad wrote: »

People are not automatically moved to some second rate, cheaper home the moment the money runs out.

Of course not, but it is a possibility and is something the OP might wish to investigate.

nad1611

I'm going away today and will be back tomorrow night. Will read all this info properly then, but in themeantime, I'd like to thank everyone so much for taking the time to help here. Be back soon.

nad1611

Thanks all. Sounds like s hard as this decision is, it's the right one. Each of us will be able to cope with different stresses and strains better or less well than others, my brother has done a great job, as he became Dad's carer almost by accident, it was never planned and as he is the linch pin that holds us all together, if he's not coping then as much as we can support him, short of leaving my own husband and family, I can't actually provide any more support than I'm doing already.
I went to the GP today and have asked him to fill out his forms as part of The Court of Protection process, which he was more than happy to do and he's also advised about getting Dad assessed for his ongoing care.

We are increasing quite considerably the care and support from ourselves and also as part of community care package, but in the meantime will look out and set our criteria for choosing a home, we've found quite a bit of good advice on the Alzheimer's site.

Can I just ask, I'm filling out the forms for the Court of Protection, both myself and my brother are going to apply, does he have to do a completely seperate and full application too? In otherwords does he have to apply completely as an individual or can we apply together so we only fill out one lot of forms and he only fill out the Deputy's Declaration?