Galloway Smashes Scottish Separatists with Stellar Speech in the Spectator

CLAPTON

beecher2 wrote: »

I was asked my reasons, and I've given them.

Fees policy is based on residence, not race or nationality. Scottish students studying in England have to pay fees.

BTW, what is the positive case for voting no? I've yet to hear it.

Scottish fees policy was specifically designed to exclude the English whilst including EU people.

Scottish people in England pay the same as English people.

beecher2

Generali wrote: »

Scotland remains part of one of the most successful countries that the world has seen during the last 300 years.

A yes is throwing all that away.

I suppose it comes down to how you define 'success'. My wish is to live in a society which is fairer than the one which has caused such deep inequalities as we see today. I think countries which place more value on quality of life rather than wealth are ones which are worth emulating.

I'd relish the opportunity to live in a country which looks again at the way we do things - I've recently read 'Blossom' by Lesley Riddoch which I would thoroughly recommend for ideas on how we can move forward as a nation. I really believe that there's an energy for change in Scotland at the moment.

beecher2

Generali wrote: »

A yes is throwing all that away just so the decision as to whether to reopen the Dumfries to Stranraer railway should be taken in London or Edinburgh.

Transport's devolved so we already make decisions regarding railways, ie the Borders Railway Project.

beecher2

CLAPTON wrote: »

Scottish fees policy was specifically designed to exclude the English whilst including EU people.

Scottish people in England pay the same as English people.

Do you seriously believe that the fees policy was established because we're all racists against the English?! Blame EU policy for EU students having access to free tuition. I agree it is unfair but think the solution is for Westminster to do away with fees.

Generali

beecher2 wrote: »

I suppose it comes down to how you define 'success'. My wish is to live in a society which is fairer than the one which has caused such deep inequalities as we see today. I think countries which place more value on quality of life rather than wealth are ones which are worth emulating.

I'd relish the opportunity to live in a country which looks again at the way we do things - I've recently read 'Blossom' by Lesley Riddoch which I would thoroughly recommend for ideas on how we can move forward as a nation. I really believe that there's an energy for change in Scotland at the moment.

The societies of the nations of the UK are far more equal that 300 years ago. By that measure the UK has been a huge success.

As Lady Thatcher said, the Good Samaritan had to have wealth as well as good intentions. The UK has used her massive income generating powers to create wealth and hence a more equal distribution of income.

An independent Scotland is an unknown quantity. What we do know is that all Nations in the UK have become steadily richer during their shared history as members of a shared country. Maybe Scotland would be richer or poorer alone, we don't know. We can say that the Union has been massively successful so far.

CLAPTON

beecher2 wrote: »

Do you seriously believe that the fees policy was established because we're all racists against the English?! Blame EU policy for EU students having access to free tuition. I agree it is unfair but think the solution is for Westminster to do away with fees.

Scotland sets it's own Uni fees policy
-they are free for scottish residence
-free for all Europeans (EU countries
except of course for the English

its is a clear choice the Scots made to discriminate against the English (& Welsh/NI)


and given your absolute amazement that anyone could think differently about the meaning of scots nationalism

I am gobsmacked that you'd think Scottish nationalism has anything to do with where people were born. It is about the people of Scotland, not the people who were born here!

one would think that an English student studying and hence living in Scotland would quality as a Scots National.

ruggedtoast

beecher2 wrote: »

I suppose it comes down to how you define 'success'. My wish is to live in a society which is fairer than the one which has caused such deep inequalities as we see today. I think countries which place more value on quality of life rather than wealth are ones which are worth emulating.

I'd relish the opportunity to live in a country which looks again at the way we do things - I've recently read 'Blossom' by Lesley Riddoch which I would thoroughly recommend for ideas on how we can move forward as a nation. I really believe that there's an energy for change in Scotland at the moment.

You mean, like the UK that recently ranked 13th out of 132 for international quality of life? Ahead of Italy, American, France and Japan.

http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/health-and-families/health-news/its-not-all-bad-britain-fares-well-in-international-quality-of-life-index-9234133.html

I really cant understand why you lot just can't be honest about why you want to be independent. None of these peripheral arguments stack up.

The cost of independence is practically everything that makes Scotland a successful wealthy country now, the benefit is you get shot of the English.

Really why can't you just be honest about that?

gik

beecher2 wrote: »

I suggest you find out what's going on up here as your description of a future independent Scotland is absolutely nothing like the one I and many others envisage.

I don't really rate George Galloway's views - he was the worst MP I've ever had and never seemed to interested in anything other than his own ego.

Criticise the man rather than his message....ever the YES mantra as per usual. He was my MP for a number of years and he was no worse than what we've had since.

ruggedtoast

The fact is its much easier to moan and blame some imagined other for your problems than it is to blame yourself.

Obviously the world isn't fair and people have all kinds of different luck, but in general, in a global socio-historical context, being resident in the United Kingdom in 2014 means you have pretty much won the lottery of life.

If there are substantial numbers of people in Scotland bearing a grudge that they haven't done better in life I'm afraid that it probably isn't 'Westminster' to blame.

IronWolf

A good speech from a great orator. I don't usually agree with anything Galloway says but here I agree whole-heartedly.

In many ways I can see a reflection of Scotlands debate with the English debate over the EU, they want to be governed by themselves and not another country, which is how many of them feel. But what the SNP need to do is stop avoiding the tough and difficult position independence will put them in. They wont have the pound, and who will buy their debt? Investors are already calling up the Treasury and panicking in case their gilts end up owed by Scotland and not the UK.

And the strangest thing for me is that Scotland wants to join the EU and Euro! Are they crazy!? They just break free from one union in order to jump into another which is far worse!? Have they not see what the big EU countries do to the likes of Greece when they run into trouble? They say tough s**t, pay us what you owe and we dont care if you cripple your economy doing it. They are the equivalent of a loan shark breaking the legs of those that cant pay.