I SUED Npower... and I WON.

[Deleted User]

You say Npowers meter readers read your meter, so how many times did you read the meter also ? How many readings did YOU submit, and did you also transpose the readings. If you also transposed them, that could be a form of fraud, getting the day reads at half price. Also , when you get the bill you could see that you were getting the billing transposed. I see this happening a lot as our G4S meter readers dont have a clue about the various eco 7 meters. There are a lot of digital electric meters around which dont give any indication whatsoever about which reading equals which period, and only the occupier could actually fathom it correctly. Personally I think you did very well in getting a huge discount on your energy bill with their first offer and you really squeezed them to the max and got lucky that they did nt turn up and you had a judge who did nt understand his own electric bill either, like you. The suppliers really are completely hopeless with eco 7 meters. They dont own the meters either so its not really their fault that its not clear whats day/night. The old meters , with the clear low/normal readings, you could nt go wrong, but with the digital meters using 1 or 2 , its not clear. When reads are transposed the only few losers are people who actually use night storage heating, they complain quickly. Mostly though its people like you, who gain with a much lower bill and, like you, they keep quiet about it until they get a huge catch up bill. You were clever enough to go through the system to win your case, but not clever enough to understand your own meter and billing.
It does nt make any sense either with a catch up bill of only 4 years transposed reads to equal £3200 as the difference is nowhere near that amount unless you are a fairly large business user

samsmoot

You deserve a medal or two. One for the cleverness in how you got your supplier changed and another for the courage in going to court. A very inspiring post - thanks for sharing.


They could ask for the Claim to be struck out [edit: not struck out - set aside] if they didn't get notified of the hearing. Seems unlikely, reading between the lines, but you should be aware that this happens.


You won because the facts contained in your Particulars of Claim were not denied and the judge was entitled, bound even, to find on those facts. Honestly speaking I could see a different judge maybe going the other way in a defended action. But then again I haven't seen the contract or the applicable law and I suspect your arguments were legally sound.


Great result, useful post and a good example to us all.

Simon7685

Bluebirdman_of_Alcathays wrote: »

I doubt npower expected to win. It was to their pecuniary advantage that they didn't contest. If they won, so be it.

I've followed your case with interest, and it would appear that energy has been consumed, and paid for. They haven't sent you a bill, which is admonishable, but what would you take them to county court for? All I can think of is the interest, which would literally amount to pence.

Is that second part refering to me or the OP? I haven't taken N Power to court yet, though it remains a possibility, unless they get their act together.

DJMC

chanz4 wrote: »

You do know they may not of recieved the paperwork, also they still would be able to appeal. I doubt they would get past their security though

They received the claim as they put in a defence.
They would have to have not received the notice of hearing and my copy evidence and witness statement sent to them by Special Delivery.

I'm aware they can put in an application to appeal.

DJMC

joncombe wrote: »

I'd be interested to know when these new rules about making sure customers are on the cheapest tariff come in (if they haven't already) how this would apply if the transposed readings meen the tariff the customer on was not the cheapest. It does seem unfair to attempt on insist payment when the customer may not have been on the best tariff but did not realise it because of the incorrect billing.

When I spoke to eon about switching to them and told them my night usage was only 15% they said that had I been with them already they would have contacted me to switch me to a single rate tariff as it would be cheaper. This is what I am now on as I have no reason to be on Economy7. Npower had never alerted me that I was not on the best tariff. This would have been a point in my court case had Npower appeared and had the judge ruled they were entitled to charge.

DJMC

Cardew wrote: »

IMO also it is a 'surprising' judgement by the Court.

It seems to me that the OP entered a contract to pay NPower Xp/kWh and Yp/kWh and was undercharged.

The OP's case seems to depend on the assertion that Npower had increased their prices, where surely they hadn't increased the price from that agreed in the contract.

Similarly I don't think the OP's Tesco analogy is valid. If the agreed price was 45p and the OP only paid 25p, then Tesco had made a mistake which they could rectify by demanding another 20p.

My understanding is that a company can claim back underpayment for 6 years. Obviously the voluntary billing code, which most(not all) energy companies have signed, restricts any claim for repayment to a 12 month period.

Over the years there have been several cases on MSE where meter readings have been transposed to the detriment of the customer. IIRC in every proven case the company have refunded the customer the full amount.

If the OP's stance on 'contract law' is taken to its logical conclusion the customer has no claim for a refund when he has overpaid.


P.S.
Given Npower's track record over the years - particularly 'Sculpting' - like other posters here I am glad the OP won. However I also think the judgement questionable; I wonder if Npower will appeal? I believe they can on a question of law.

But what IS the price agreed in the contract? Surely it is the price which appears on each bill? Npower sent me bills showing an amount of electricity used with a unit price against each of the two types of unit, albeit transposed one to the other. THEY chose to charge me these prices for each type. I paid the bills as charged.
Contract complete under UK law.

lstar337

DJMC wrote: »

When I spoke to eon about switching to them and told them my night usage was only 15% they said that had I been with them already they would have contacted me to switch me to a single rate tariff as it would be cheaper.

Easy to say over the phone. In practice, I doubt it would have happened, and even if it had, it wouldn't have happened quickly!

DJMC

sacsquacco wrote: »

You say Npowers meter readers read your meter, so how many times did you read the meter also ? How many readings did YOU submit, and did you also transpose the readings. If you also transposed them, that could be a form of fraud, getting the day reads at half price. Also , when you get the bill you could see that you were getting the billing transposed. I see this happening a lot as our G4S meter readers dont have a clue about the various eco 7 meters. There are a lot of digital electric meters around which dont give any indication whatsoever about which reading equals which period, and only the occupier could actually fathom it correctly. Personally I think you did very well in getting a huge discount on your energy bill with their first offer and you really squeezed them to the max and got lucky that they did nt turn up and you had a judge who did nt understand his own electric bill either, like you. The suppliers really are completely hopeless with eco 7 meters. They dont own the meters either so its not really their fault that its not clear whats day/night. The old meters , with the clear low/normal readings, you could nt go wrong, but with the digital meters using 1 or 2 , its not clear. When reads are transposed the only few losers are people who actually use night storage heating, they complain quickly. Mostly though its people like you, who gain with a much lower bill and, like you, they keep quiet about it until they get a huge catch up bill. You were clever enough to go through the system to win your case, but not clever enough to understand your own meter and billing.
It does nt make any sense either with a catch up bill of only 4 years transposed reads to equal £3200 as the difference is nowhere near that amount unless you are a fairly large business user

I'm a domestic user.

Npower read my meter in at least 2011 and 2013. I don't have a bill earlier to 2011 but I guess they read it earlier too. They had installed a new meter in 2009 which had, I now know, been set to zero at that point.

I read the meter in between their readings, noting down the "1" and "4" readings, seeing nothing on the meter itself to explain which of these was night and which day.

I looked at my previous bill and found it obvious which reading related to night and which to day as the totals for each were vastly different, say 6000 and 30000. I phoned Npower's automated meter reading line and gave the readings, innocently transposed following the only "guidance" I could find on the bill, that of Npower's own transposition. Had I known the meter had been set to zero I may have been able to work out that the higher unit figure must relate to day usage, but for a long time we were using washing machine and dishwasher in the night to take advantage of the cheaper rate so even then it may not have alerted me. In reality I blindly followed where Npower lead. Why would I question what their trained meter readers had checked?

In May 2013 I received the "Actual" reading bill and complained that the lower reading was 1000 or so higher than the reading on the day I received it. Even during that conversation the transposed readings did not come to light, and that was with an Npower agent asking me for the actual readings on the day of my call. If meters read "day" and "night" rather 1, 2, 4 or whatever, transposing errors may be reduced dramatically.

DJMC

Simon7685 wrote: »

Is that second part refering to me or the OP? I haven't taken N Power to court yet, though it remains a possibility, unless they get their act together.

I think it refers to you.

DJMC

samsmoot wrote: »

You deserve a medal or two. One for the cleverness in how you got your supplier changed and another for the courage in going to court. A very inspiring post - thanks for sharing.


They could ask for the Claim to be struck out if they didn't get notified of the hearing. Seems unlikely, reading between the lines, but you should be aware that this happens.


You won because the facts contained in your Particulars of Claim were not denied and the judge was entitled, bound even, to find on those facts. Honestly speaking I could see a different judge maybe going the other way in a defended action. But then again I haven't seen the contract or the applicable law and I suspect your arguments were legally sound.


Great result, useful post and a good example to us all.

It remains to be seen if Npower take me to court for the further period. That bill is around £400 as charged, perhaps £200 if amended along the lines of the judge's order following my submissions relating to contract law and their own T&Cs.
I'm happy to pay the amended charge, once calculated.

Having represented myself in the High Court in another matter, in front of an expert company law QC judge, against a high profile lawyer who acts in multi-hundred million pound law suits (seemingly a "white knight") and who had applied to set aside a winding up order I obtained against his limited company, I know that judges don't like the rulings of their fellow judges to be questioned and understandably so.
I won that case also.