Dismissal, references and what to put on job applications

the_darkknight_2

Hello all

Basically I have just been dismissed from my job of 6 months. I had my probation review meeting and they had to 'let me go' for reasons that were very vague. I have my suspicions about why (a colleagues sister has now taken my job role - surprise surprise) however what is done is done and it's time to move on.

I have just seen a job I would like to apply for that has a lot of relevance to the job I have been dismissed from. However, how do I get around the fact I was dismissed on the application form? and what do I do with regards to providing a reference? I take it as I was only working there for 6 month and was sacked, they are not going to give me one - or a positive one, anyway.

I was in my previous job for 6 years and I know they will provide me with a glowing reference. But I can't put down what I did in my most recent job and NOT put them as referees, can I? I can't really leave it off my CV either as I'll have a massive gap I have to try and explain.

I can't help but feel it's a lose lose situation. Put the job I was dismissed that is VERY relevant to the new role on, but get no reference or a poor one. Or, leave a huge gap on the CV and just put my previous but far less relevant job on with a good reference. I don't know what leaves the best impression, if any!

Help?

g0liath

the_darkknight wrote: »

I can't help but feel it's a lose lose situation. Put the job I was dismissed that is VERY relevant to the new role on, but get no reference or a poor one. Or, leave a huge gap on the CV and just put my previous but far less relevant job on with a good reference. I don't know what leaves the best impression, if any!

Help?

Hi. I would ask by email very politely if you can expect a reference. I am lead to believe that they may not provide a reference but have to supply a reasonable (Not a bad) reference if they do.
If they say they will you can make your wording appropriate to the reasons why. It is important to tell the truth as any future employer may genuinely sack you (Gross misconduct) if you are found not to have been truthful.
I my case, I was dismissed for gross misconduct and I did advise future employers the reason and mentioned I am taking them to the Employment tribunal. It limited my scope so I had to go Self employed but people I do business with are not bothered. Its a tough one that.

jonnyd281

g0liath wrote: »

Hi. I would ask by email very politely if you can expect a reference. I am lead to believe that they may not provide a reference but have to supply a reasonable (Not a bad) reference if they do.

No a reference must be truthful, that doesn't mean that you can't have a bad reference.
If no one could give a bad reference they would be meaningless.

elsien

g0liath wrote: »

I am lead to believe that they may not provide a reference but have to supply a reasonable (Not a bad) reference if they do.
.

Not true. Employers can give a "bad" reference if it is factually accurate and they have evidence to back it up. They can also choose not to give a reference, or can stick to basic facts such as dates of employment, and no more.
In the OP's case, if they were so vague about the reasons for not keeping the OP on, then they're possibly going to find it hard to justify anything more than the basic facts.
I think the OP needs to sound them out if possible about if they are prepared to give a reference, what it might cover, then take it from there.

DCFC79

They might not even supply one, might only give start and end date for your employment, whatever they give it has to be an honest one.

the_darkknight_2

g0liath wrote: »

Hi. I would ask by email very politely if you can expect a reference. I am lead to believe that they may not provide a reference but have to supply a reasonable (Not a bad) reference if they do.
If they say they will you can make your wording appropriate to the reasons why. It is important to tell the truth as any future employer may genuinely sack you (Gross misconduct) if you are found not to have been truthful.
I my case, I was dismissed for gross misconduct and I did advise future employers the reason and mentioned I am taking them to the Employment tribunal. It limited my scope so I had to go Self employed but people I do business with are not bothered. Its a tough one that.

Thanks. A few choice words were said between me at the HR woman as she was getting personal towards me which I'm afraid I draw the line at. She was also comparing my performance directly to certain members of the team which again I feel is incredibly poor taste. I was very blunt and stern with her (not verbally abusive), so I strongly suspect I will not be getting any sort of reference from them.

It wasn't misconduct I was sacked for. Just let go at the end of my probation.

The job I want to apply for is a civil service job (previously always in the private sector).

DUTR

the_darkknight wrote: »

Hello all

Basically I have just been dismissed from my job of 6 months. I had my probation review meeting and they had to 'let me go' for reasons that were very vague. I have my suspicions about why (a colleagues sister has now taken my job role - surprise surprise) however what is done is done and it's time to move on.

I have just seen a job I would like to apply for that has a lot of relevance to the job I have been dismissed from. However, how do I get around the fact I was dismissed on the application form? and what do I do with regards to providing a reference? I take it as I was only working there for 6 month and was sacked, they are not going to give me one - or a positive one, anyway.

I was in my previous job for 6 years and I know they will provide me with a glowing reference. But I can't put down what I did in my most recent job and NOT put them as referees, can I? I can't really leave it off my CV either as I'll have a massive gap I have to try and explain.

I can't help but feel it's a lose lose situation. Put the job I was dismissed that is VERY relevant to the new role on, but get no reference or a poor one. Or, leave a huge gap on the CV and just put my previous but far less relevant job on with a good reference. I don't know what leaves the best impression, if any!

Help?

Perhaps you are looking into it too deeply, let go after 6 months in the circumstances you describe simply means you didn't achieve standards during the probationary period, they can still give areference to say "darknight worked for us for the last 6 months" also you were with the 2nd previous employer for 6 years so that reference will count, it's your CV and job application that has to be glowing along with your interview.

elsien

the_darkknight wrote: »

I was very blunt and stern with her (not verbally abusive), so I strongly suspect I will not be getting any sort of reference from them.

.

OK, now wondering if one of the reasons you were let go has anything to do with your manner and attitude....
Plus surely measuring performance is a standard way of assessing whether you're doing your job effectively when deciding whether to keep you on or not?

the_darkknight_2

elsien wrote: »

OK, now wondering if one of the reasons you were let go has anything to do with your manner and attitude....
Plus surely measuring performance is a standard way of assessing whether you're doing your job effectively when deciding whether to keep you on or not?

I was stern AFTER they had given me the boot. She was very patronizing to me, started getting personal and was directly comparing my performance to other named members of staff. I'm a nice person and will take constructive criticism, however I will not be patronized and slated on a personal level which is unnecessary and uncalled for. So yes, I did call them up on it and wasn't happy with the way I had been treated.

[Deleted User]

OP are you asked to provide more then 1 reference? can you put both down, I've been laid of and had glowing references wrote which is apparently just as bad (Yep sometimes guilt = good reference) so there is no perfect reference - just give your side of the story as positively as you can, lots of employers today just ask for dates worked if it boils down to it (if at all depending where you are wanting to work) and I think that is the best way. Personal conversations asking if you'll get a reference in advance are tricky, don't lead yourself into an argument unnecessarily leave that to the recruiter first ; )






I've often wondered how people whose employers no longer exist manage, just how valid is a reference at a place that was worked at yesteryear, but somehow apparently they do

the_darkknight_2

Right ok, so what is the verdict about what I should do?

Should I leave the job I was dismissed from off the application?

Or put it on and take my chances with the reference? baring in mind that my old employee's will give me a good reference, which should hopefully balance it out.

If I put it on my application, what am I supposed to put for "Reason for leaving"? is 'contact ended' ok seeing as technically my contract was ended.....sounds better than 'dismissed'?