Unfair Dismissal - DIY Employment Tribunal

Undervalued

g0liath wrote: »

You don't pay the other sides costs, the fees are paid up front and it is for the judge to decide on the facts. It has never been about the money. there are details that cant be released at the moment. This is is about showing that you can stand up for yourself and do it yourself. I will gladly publish everything within the law after the event which is soon.

Ill informed comments like that will not help people to go to tribunal with genuine claims.

You don't normally have to pay the other sides costs. However costs can be awarded by an ET if they feel your case is vexatious or so weak it should never have been brought.

Although still fairly rare the number of costs awards has risen in recent years.

Usually there will have been a warning from the judge at a pre hearing if this is likely to happen. However some LIP can be so wrapped up in the "rights" of their case that they fail to heed even very heavy hints.

Be careful with phrases like "it has never been about the money". Strictly speaking that is an abuse of process. The function of a civil court (including an ET) is to award compensation if you have been wronged. It is not for settling scores or punishing the party you consider to be "guilty".

AndyPK

Are costs limited to £10k?

Undervalued

AndyPK wrote: »

Are costs limited to £10k?

I think so. They certainly were but I'm rather out of touch these days.

sensibleadvice

g0liath wrote: »

You are right, there is no way to know but its no excuse to tell lies and not expect the consequences. If what had happened did happen then I would not be spending the beat time away from my baby challenging this so vehemently.

So the victim claims they're offended about comments that were against their religion, belittling and demeaning. The perpetrator have decided that they've made up those feelings yet accepts there's no way to know. Good luck present that as evidence.

Plenty of other reasons why you'd challenge, attempting to get GM for racism off the record for one.

lakes17

g0liath wrote: »

You are right, there is no way to know but its no excuse to tell lies and not expect the consequences. If what had happened did happen then I would not be spending the beat time away from my baby challenging this so vehemently.

You state that the victim is telling lies as to how they felt with your comment. You also state in a previous post that the victim was laughing about your comment. How do you know how the victim was feeling inside. He/she could be happy on the outside but in reality "bottling up" their feelings until it becomes to much and the Employer has to then take the appropriate action which would come under the "Dignity at Work" Policy. The jokes you made about Ramadan should not be made in the work place or anywhere else for that matter and it is right that it is a serious matter and disciplinary action should be taken.


You have also stated in another post that this is not the first time you have faced allegation about racism but the first one was worse and following an appeal you received a final warning. You believe because of that the sanction should be less than a final warning. But that is irrelevant because even "spent" warnings can be taken into consideration if it is deemed the same or similar allegation has taken place again. And it is not unusual for the sanction to be more severe even if the second allegation wasn't as bad. In your case this would be dismissal and the Employer would be able to justify this decision on the basis that you have learned nothing from your final warning.


You definitely have an uphill battle for the ET to find in your favour.

Undervalued

lakes17 wrote: »

You state that the victim is telling lies as to how they felt with your comment. You also state in a previous post that the victim was laughing about your comment. How do you know how the victim was feeling inside. He/she could be happy on the outside but in reality "bottling up" their feelings until it becomes to much and the Employer has to then take the appropriate action which would come under the "Dignity at Work" Policy. The jokes you made about Ramadan should not be made in the work place or anywhere else for that matter and it is right that it is a serious matter and disciplinary action should be taken.


You have also stated in another post that this is not the first time you have faced allegation about racism but the first one was worse and following an appeal you received a final warning. You believe because of that the sanction should be less than a final warning. But that is irrelevant because even "spent" warnings can be taken into consideration if it is deemed the same or similar allegation has taken place again. And it is not unusual for the sanction to be more severe even if the second allegation wasn't as bad. In your case this would be dismissal and the Employer would be able to justify this decision on the basis that you have learned nothing from your final warning.


You definitely have an uphill battle for the ET to find in your favour.

My thoughts exactly.

uknick

AndyPK wrote: »

Are costs limited to £10k?

No. An ET judge can only award up to about £10k, but he can refer it to a county court where there is no limit.

But, as said, to get a costs award one side has to do something to really p***s the judge off.

zzzLazyDaisy

The max costs award made in 2012/13 was £54k.

http://www.morton-fraser.com/blog/employment/3932_employment_tribunal_statistics_2012-2013

That being said, the number of cases in which costs orders were actually made was a tiny percentage of the over all number of cases pursued. The fact remains that the risk of a costs award in tribunal is still extremely low.

g0liath

I won the case - The racism was discounted. I am so Happy!

AndyPK

Excellent. Congratulations.