Problem lodger damaged room - help required

Guest101

moneyistooshorttomention wrote: »

I wouldn't agree with you there. Lodgers and tenants are 2 very different "animals".

A tenant is living in their own accommodation (ie quite separate from the landlord/lady's home) and therefore one set of rules/laws applies.

A lodger is living in someone's own home with them and therefore a different set of circumstances entirely.

I think you are scaring the OP unnecessarily.

No reasonable person (be they judge or otherwise) would expect someone to put up with such "bad behaviour" in their own home.

I certainly never had any legal problems with badly-behaved lodgers if they had to leave....not so much as one breath of that sort of trouble from them. If they were badly-behaved they went...end of...and I don't seem to recall that they then had recourse to any legal ways to try and "get back at me" for having acted so badly that they had to be given notice.

Look at it this way...is a judge seriously going to expect a lone woman, for instance, to put up with some nasty person staying under their own roof/using their own kitchen and bathroom/etc against that persons will?

The contract states 2 months notice, that's what the op needs to give.

It's a contract, mitigating circumstances are just that unless it's a crime. Ie nasty person - domestic violence?

The op cannot break the contract by themselves. Similarly I would not give the op advice which leaves them open to being sued.

moneyistooshorttomention

One quick google later and I found:

www.spareroom.co.uk/content/info-flatshering/rights-for-renters-for-tenants-and-lodgers

and there is a bit in that, for instance, that says lodgers only have to be given "reasonable notice" and that is quoted as "normally 28 days...but could be shorter".

I certainly always interpreted "reasonable" as what the normal person in the street would regard as "reasonable" if they knew of the lodgers' behaviour.

The normal person in the street would not regard it as "reasonable" to be expected to put up with someone living in their own home that was threatening them/stealing from them/not paying their way as agreed or, as in this case, making the place absolutely filthy and a health hazard.

Personally, before now I've regarded as Unreasonable:
- not paying the agreed rent
- being a "filthy little tyke"
- endangering the security of my home
- making me feel my own personal safety was at risk

EDIT: The website came up generally, rather than with a specific bit I mention. So try googling "what legal rights do lodgers have" and it will come up that way.

Guest101

FR_262 wrote: »

You can put whatever you like in a contract, but he's still a lodger and his status is not the same as it would be if the LL lived out. He isn't a tenant and so his rights are considerably less.

You couldn't be more wrong, I'm not saying he's a tenant. But the contract still stands

moneyistooshorttomention

Of course...there is always the possibility as well of getting the local Council's Environmental Health Dept in on this and see if they will inspect the lodgers room:rotfl:

I imagine it would be quite easy to have the rest of the house sparkling clean and then "Ta da....take a look at this room. I fear for my health thanks to this person....".

Seriously though (though I would personally be quite prepared to have done that if need be) OP was a bit naïve to give a contract to this filthy tyke, but I doubt they have put themselves in legal schtook because of it. I would just tell the EH Dept that I'm afraid I had been a bit naïve...and then repeat that I was concerned for my health and wondering if someone so filthy might have brought in "critturs" to my nice clean home.

No harm in telling the lodger in advance that that was exactly what was going to happen if they didn't move out timeously...

Guest101

Absolutely the op can contact eh. I would suggest that they voluntarily end the contract between both parties, get something in writing.

I would not 'evict' though, as it's a can of worms

Kynthia

moneyistooshorttomention wrote: »

One quick google later and I found:

www.spareroom.co.uk/content/info-flatshering/rights-for-renters-for-tenants-and-lodgers

and there is a bit in that, for instance, that says lodgers only have to be given "reasonable notice" and that is quoted as "normally 28 days...but could be shorter".
.

As has been stated earlier, lodgers don't have the rights of tenants and without any other contractural agreement their statutory rights are only 'reasonable notice'. However there is a signed contract which now means the lodger can sue for losses caused by the OP breaking the contract. This is why people should be careful what they agree to in a contract with a lodger as no-one wants to be stuck with someone in their own home when the relationship has broken down. I'd personally be horrified by including a fixed term and a month or more as notice as that shows that someone didn't think about the consequences. I'd have rent paid monthly, with 1.5 months deposit and 2 weeks notice, plus a signed inventory at the start.

OP giving a week or two as notice could leave you open to bing sued but you may decide it's worth the risk. I believe you can only be sued for losses and if you don't charge rent beyond the notice period and your lodger finds somewhere else, and isn't forced to use hotels, then I'm not sure how much loss they could incur. However you should probably research this to be sure.

Guest101

Kynthia wrote: »

As has been stated earlier, lodgers don't have the rights of tenants and without any other contractural agreement their statutory rights are only 'reasonable notice'. However there is a signed contract which now means the lodger can sue for losses caused by the OP breaking the contract. This is why people should be careful what they agree to in a contract with a lodger as no-one wants to be stuck with someone in their own home when the relationship has broken down. I'd personally be horrified by including a fixed term and a month or more as notice as that shows that someone didn't think about the consequences. I'd have rent paid monthly, with 1.5 months deposit and 2 weeks notice, plus a signed inventory at the start.

OP giving a week or two as notice could leave you open to bing sued but you may decide it's worth the risk. I believe you can only be sued for losses and if you don't charge rent beyond the notice period and your lodger finds somewhere else, and isn't forced to use hotels, then I'm not sure how much loss they could incur. However you should probably research this to be sure.

Spot on. Unfortunately this could include admin fees, storage costs, time off work etc. and property damage if op removes property.

BigAunty

moneyistooshorttomention wrote: »

Of course...there is always the possibility as well of getting the local Council's Environmental Health Dept in on this and see if they will inspect the lodgers room:rotfl:

...

I assume their remit is to protect lodgers/tenants from landlords and this is out of scope for their inspection....

moneyistooshorttomention

BigAunty wrote: »

I assume their remit is to protect lodgers/tenants from landlords and this is out of scope for their inspection....

I don't see why things shouldn't "go the other way around" personally.

As stated, I would have been quite prepared to go down this route in the circumstances and if EH tried to be one-sided and be awkward about helping me on "my side of this", then I'd head off to a suitable local Councillor and get them to get onto them on my behalf.

The more I think of this...the more I like the idea and think it has distinct possibilities and it may well be quite enough, on its own, to tell the lodger that they were going to be called in if they hadn't removed their "stinky self" promptly. Worth giving the EO a ring to check out possibilities I would say....

After all...bedbugs, for instance, aren't going to be too particular about whether they migrate from one room to another if the lodger has brought them in (or might have done...).

I know I certainly wondered why I was itching a bit when I had in the worst Mr Filthy I had in and seriously suspected he might have imported a few things. I went in spraying his room with suitable bug killer a couple of times because I was that concerned about it...before I decided I was being ridiculous to put my health at risk of using chemicals I wouldn't use of myself in my own home and gave him one quick notice period to get out and he did...

Mind you...I was starting to get a bit suspicious that I had inadvertently taken in an illegal immigrant (rather than the student he told me he was) and I think it was becoming obvious I was getting a bit suspicious about not seeing any evidence of studying....

BigAunty

moneyistooshorttomention wrote: »

I don't see why things shouldn't "go the other way around" personally.

As stated, I would have been quite prepared to go down this route in the circumstances and if EH tried to be one-sided and be awkward about helping me on "my side of this", then I'd head off to a suitable local Councillor and get them to get onto them on my behalf.

.. Worth giving the EO a ring to check out possibilities I would say....
..

In the scheme of things, this is a minor tenancy agreement/civil contract dispute that can be resolved either through negotiation or serving notice or taking legal action in the small claims court.

I pity the local councillor and EH officers if they are sucked into such minor matters as an incontinent lodger and their smelly room. I imagine they would not act in anyway but tell the person enquiring that it is a civil legal matter....