Vehicle Control Services - POPLA time

Olivier

Update 24/01/2014

Just got an email from POPLA, appeal allowed, the operator should cancel the charge immediately.

Update 22/11/2013

I received the rejection letter, see page 3 of topic.

Will work on POPLA appeal.



ORIGINAL POST
Hello,

I have today received a "Parking Charge Notice" from VCS.

A few days ago someone came to pick me up at Liverpool Airport, and stopped in a "No stopping / waiting in restriction areas or roadways", with double red lines.

The driver left the engine running and moved to the passenger side while I hoped in the driver seat and left. The Whole thing took less than 30 seconds, as the 3 pictures on the notice show. Interestingly the first one where the driver cannot be seen only shows the car as it arrived, not showing myself waiting by the kerb.

Obviously they are asking for £60 now or £100 after 14 days, which I am not keen to pay.

Do I ignore the letter (as I know it could be done for parking issues with Parking Eye at Lidl and other places), or do I need to write an appeal?

I also have several questions...

1) who's technically the driver? The one who arrived or the one who left?

2) I have never seen / realised this was a private land / under private management and evidently have never accepted the potential T&C. Is that worth mentioning?

3) the text states "this PCN is issued.... for allegedly breaching the T&C of use of the privately operated access roads, etc. [...] The T&C to which the driver agrees to be contractually bound upon entering the car park are clearly placed at the entrance to the car park

The driver never entered the airport's car park, as I was picked up at the roundabout before the road to the car park.

4) the notice was delivered as normal mail. What if it got lost? What would have happened?

I'd really appreciate your help on this. There are many templates around but I'm still wondering whether to use one.

Coupon-mad

Doesn't matter a jot who was driving because you are advised to appeal ONLY as the registered keeper, without implying who the driver was at all. That's because your position is stronger to challenge it from the point of view of the keeper who has just received their letter. Not as the driver, not taking about 'what happened' at all.

Search the forum for keyword 'Liverpool' or 'Airport' to find DOZENS of other threads where the advice about the challenge is already there for you to see and follow. There are specific arguments about Airport land as you will learn from the other threads about this place when you search.

Use the 'search this forum' title on the right just above the sticky threads on the first page of this parking forum board. Change the default search to 'show posts' (NOT 'show threads' as it auto defaults to) and you will find what you need when searching for one of those two keywords. Search one word at a time is best IMHO as you will see more Airport thread; Luton Airport threads are just as useful to you. Very similar but with a different PPC on site.

Was this Notice sent to you with 14 days of the incident, or not? If it had got lost they would have bothered you with another letter later on!

Olivier

Thank you very much. Yes the incident was less than 14 days ago.

I have taken one of your templates and amended it as below, replacing the PPC name, and removing the "£105 is over the limit" argument as they're only (!) charging £60/£100

Do I need to send this registered?

****************
It is clear from your Notice of xx/xx/2013 that you issued it with a view to pursuing keeper liability under Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 (POFA). The BPA Code of Practice (CoP) supports the need for strict compliance (para 21.5 refers).

I write to challenge the Notice and to inform you that Vehicle Control Services Ltd has failed to meet the strict requirements that might have enabled you to pursue this matter with myself (the registered keeper). In summary, you have issued a defective Notice to attempt to claim from me an unjustifiable charge, on Airport-owned land where no keeper liability is likely to apply at all, due to local bylaws taking precedence.

I would draw your attention to the Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations 2008. No doubt your legal advisors will be able to explain the issues which cause your misleading 'Notice to Owner/Keeper' to be a nullity in law, which include (but are not necessarily limited to):

- Claiming the right to 'registered keeper liability' under the POFA when that right is simply not available on land covered by local Bylaws. Railway or Airport land is generally not 'relevant land' under the definition within the POFA and if you contend otherwise I will require documentary evidence outlining the existence and wording of any current railway bylaws or written confirmation from the landowner that there are none applicable at this site.

- Copying the name of a Local Authority Notice by labelling it “Parking Charge Notice” for a document that must (under POFA and the CoP) simply be called a 'Notice to Keeper' is misleading. This appears to me as a clear impersonation of authority - a stance which is specifically prohibited in the CoP.

- Failing to include specific identification as to who 'the Creditor' may be, is misleading and not compliant, in regards to paragraph 9(2)(h) of Schedule 4 of the POFA. Whilst your Notice has indicated that you require a payment to be made to Vehicle Control Services Ltd, there is no specific identification of the Creditor, who may, in law, be Vehicle Control Services Ltd or some other party. The POFA requires a ‘Notice to Keeper’ to have words to the effect that 'The Creditor is….' and your Notice does not.

- Claiming the sum of £100 is not only misleading but wholly unjustified. I require Vehicle Control Services Ltd to provide me with a copy of your BPA-sanctioned approval for this excessive charge for this particular contravention at this particular site. I also require a full breakdown of how this amount has been calculated and whether you are alleging trespass or breach of contract. This information is required now, so that I can fully understand the basis for your 'charge' for the purposes of my POPLA appeal, should Vehicle Control Services Ltd decide not to cancel this invoice immediately.

I will also require a copy of your contract with the landowner/occupier which you are relying upon. If it is a redacted copy then there must still be evidence in the document which shows that the contract complies with the CoP and specifically allows Vehicle Control Services Ltd to pursue these 'charges' in their own name as creditor, in the courts.

If you pursue the matter against me as registered keeper and issue any further correspondence or make any form of contact (except to cancel the charge or reject the challenge and send me details of how to appeal to POPLA) this will be considered harassment. In that event I will lodge an official complaint with the BPA Ltd and the DVLA AOS Compliance Manager, as well as with the Office of the Information Commissioner. I also reserve the right to forward a complaint to the relevant Trading Standards office concerning your commercial practices which which appear to be in breach of the CPUTR and the CoP.

Take formal notice that I will of course include your client (the landowner and/or Train Operator) in any complaints and, in addition, they will be named as jointly and severally liable in any future court claim I may seek to lodge with MCOL, for damages for harassment and specific breaches of the above Acts.

I do not expect to receive a ‘generic’ template response and which fails to address the specific issues that I have raised with you. No further correspondence will be entered into, except a POPLA appeal which I will gladly submit if Vehicle Control Services Ltd choose to fund that stage. No further warning will be given if I pursue the matter through the Small Claims Track against Vehicle Control Services Ltd and your client at this site.

I therefore expect you to immediately cancel the ‘parking charge’ and inform me in writing that you have done so. In addition, Vehicle Control Services Ltd are required to remove my personal data (and that of the vehicle) from all formats of storage, immediately following cancellation, since you have no lawful excuse to keep my data.

Yours faithfully,

PRINT NAME' (no need to give them your real signature)
********************

Umkomaas

Claiming the sum of £100 is not only misleading but wholly unjustified. I require APCOA to provide me with a copy of your BPA-sanctioned approval for this excessive charge for this particular contravention at this particular site. I also require a full breakdown of how this amount has been calculated and whether you are alleging trespass or breach of contract. This information is required now, so that I can fully understand the basis for your 'charge' for the purposes of my POPLA appeal, should Vehicle Control Services Ltd decide not to cancel this invoice immediately.

You've got 2 PPCs mentioned here!

I write to challenge the Notice and to inform you that Vehicle Control Services Ltd has failed to meet the strict requirements that might have enabled you to pursue this matter with myself (the registered keeper). In summary, you have issued a defective Notice to attempt to claim from me a charge in excess of the industry CoP maximum, on Airport-owned land where no keeper liability is likely to apply at all, due to local bylaws taking precedence.

Where have they claimed a charge in excess of the industry CoP maximum?

You seem to be rushing at this a bit. What are you hoping to achieve with this appeal?

bod1467

Save the silver bullets for a POPLA appeal. Soft appeal now (to get a POPLA code) then bite them then.

MrsG1980

Can anyone point me in the right direction for this please.
PCN Received - Date of issue 27/9/13 - Vehicle control services ltd.
I was picking my husband up from the airport with my 2 kids (I knew he would be ready as we had just watched his plane lane from the hill at the back of the airport) As I am driving up towards the airport my 2 year old chocked on his water in the back of the car. I stopped on the road leading up to the airport to clear his throat and make sure he was ok. I stopped for less than a minute with hazards on, then drove up and round the corner to the drop off/pick up area, got my husband and we left.
I must admit I did not know that this road was a no stopping area, but I would have stopped even if I did know as my son was in distress!
Do I appeal this to Vehicle control services, telling them that my son was in distress, or do I just say that there were no signs big enough to make me aware that this was a no stopping zone??
Any help will be greatly appreciated. Thanks xx

Olivier

You're right, I'm rushing a bit. I'm quite annoyed by this.

I have amended the 2nd PPC and changed the wording into "an unjustifiable charge".

What I want to achieve is for them to drop the case.

I also found the template from parkingcowboys.co.uk/appeal-letter quite good, although it's a challenge, not an appeal? What do I need to send to ensure this stops asap without me parting with my cash?

MrsG1980

sorry, I jumped in your thread there. I have posted my own but awaiting your responses too as they may help me! lol

Olivier

bod1467 wrote: »

Save the silver bullets for a POPLA appeal. Soft appeal now (to get a POPLA code) then bite them then.

Something like this?

************
Dear Sir / Madam

I am writing to you regarding parking charge notice xxxxxxxxxxx issued to vehicle xxxx xxx on xx/xx/2013.

Your charge is punitive, unjustifiable and unenforceable. I require you to either cancel the charge forthwith or provide me with a POPLA code so that I can refer the matter to POPLA.

Regards

Name.

*************

Umkomaas

You really should spend a bit of time reading the most recent forum threads. How do I know you've not done enough?

What I want to achieve is for them to drop the case.

There's next to no chance. They pay John Lennon Airport big money so they can scam you, so why would they drop your charge? Have a look here:

http://parking-prankster.blogspot.co.uk/2013/09/how-much-does-john-lennon-airport-make.html

The more you understand this stuff, the better your chance of killing it off. Appealing to any semblance of understanding or fair play in a PPC, or by making quasi-legal arguments at the initial appeal stage is not only a waste of breath but also a waste of time.

They have to be stopped dead in their tracks, and the way to achieve that is via a successful POPLA appeal. And that's where the arguments you've put forward above are best placed - as bod1467 says 'Save the silver bullets for the POPLA appeal'. Don't shoot your best shot too soon.

You need a soft appeal (you'll get to know what that is with a bit of research), citing lack of visible signage is probably good enough and requiring them to issue a POPLA code should they (and they will) reject your appeal.

Do not disclose who was driving - general default advice, but especially important where byelaws cover the area, as PoFA doesn't apply, and therefore they can only pursue the driver.

In any correspondence, there's no 'I didn't see the signs', it needs to be 'The driver did not see the signs'. Everything in the 3rd person.

So a bit more reading, then come back if you need some further advice on your soft appeal. If not send it off and await your rejection and POPLA code, but don't be surprised if they come back requiring more detail from you. They are reluctant to issue POPLA codes - because they know what's coming their way

HTH

Umkomaas

Olivier wrote: »

Something like this?

************
Dear Sir / Madam

I am writing to you regarding parking charge notice xxxxxxxxxxx issued to vehicle xxxx xxx on xx/xx/2013.

Your charge is punitive, unjustifiable and unenforceable. I require you to either cancel the charge forthwith or provide me with a POPLA code so that I can refer the matter to POPLA.

Regards

Name.

*************

OP - my prior post was in the process of drafting when you posted this. Your soft appeal is fine; you may want to add a sentence too on signage, as the signs at JLA are very small and not easily visible - was it dark at the time of your incident?

Good to go then!