Do you believe fracking in the UK will bring lower consumer energy costs?

lstar337

sheffield_lad wrote: »

The reason for your bills going up though has very little to do with profit (roughly 5%), of the cost of your gas/electric.

It's facts like we are now an importer of gas and the whole world now wants cheap fuel.

We were not an importer of gas 3 years ago?

sheffield_lad wrote: »

Consider the uk average bill for gas/leccy £120 per month now think about the cost of the digital age (sky, mobile, b/band), there is little in it yet £120 keeps you warm and runs the above.

You are failing to understand my post. The utilities say "reduce consumption to reduce bills", I say "that doesn't work, here is my evidence"

sheffield_lad wrote: »

Is it expensive or fair value when you consider other costs?

Read my post. I never said it was expensive or unfair. I said the advice they give is BS.

sheffield_lad wrote: »

Consider the uk average bill for gas/leccy £120 per month now think about the cost of the digital age (sky, mobile, b/band), there is little in it yet £120 keeps you warm and runs the above.

I don't have Sky or Broadband or even a landline phone, they are too expensive.

lstar337

sheffield_lad wrote: »

What does your bb/mob/sky add up to as you can reduce these?

Enlighten me, how do I reduce them when I don't have them?

lstar337

sheffield lad, you have brought in an argument that nobody was having. I think you have your wires crossed.

3lions

I am old enough to remember that they told us that the gas from the north sea (a by-product of oil which was initially burnt off) would be "free" energy. This was when they converted from coal produced gas (making coke and gas). probably in the early seventies. We all know what happened there!

There is NO chance that prices will come down. They may stabilize but wont come down long term or short term. They will tax to the hilt and its the consumer that foots the bill for extracting it in the first place.

Andy_WSM

sheffield_lad wrote: »

What does your bb/mob/sky add up to as you can reduce these?

Oh gosh, that all got cut out years ago. 5 years of not having a pay rise has taken it's toll on the standard of living here.

BB - BT basic package, about £10 a month. - Need this as I work from home.

Mob - SIM only, no contract, old iPhone, £12.50 per month.

SKY - You must be joking, I don't even have a TV Aerial / Freeview and hence a TV Licence any more.

Do I consider £120 a month expensive? Yes I do! It's about 10% of what I take home

PollySouthend

sheffield_lad wrote: »

You need to think about the schools, hospitals, roads etc built since the 1960's most if not all were covered by the North sea gas/oil.

I really would like to believe that, what is your evidence?

Germany has virtually no oil and manages pretty well.

sheffield_lad

lstar337 wrote: »

sheffield lad, you have brought in an argument that nobody was having. I think you have your wires crossed.

I was trying to make the point that you can't just say using less means they will automatically increase your price it does not work like that.

If your consumption had not gone down you would be paying roughly the same unit price but your bills would be higher given you would be using more.

Europe is a good comparison as Germany & France have similar populations and living standards.

We can jump around all we like the fact is unless fracking is used energy will continue to increase as more and more folk seek what we have enjoyed for the past 30yrs cheap fuel.

The biggest increase in price's actually came in one year 2008 when Russia threatened to cut the gas pipe off. This caused a 40% rise in fuel costs (if you remember petrol shot up from £1 to £1.40 also), it was an energy crisis and like all increases those prices have not come back down.

Which going back to fracking shows why we need a secure supply.

sheffield_lad

PollySouthend wrote: »

I really would like to believe that, what is your evidence?

Germany has virtually no oil and manages pretty well.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/comment/edmundconway/6505670/North-Sea-oil-is-dragging-us-into-the-red.html

One of the peculiarities of British politics – and economics – is the reluctance to take into account the critical contribution of oil to the economy. We spend so much time droning on about our excessive reliance on the financial sector that we tend to ignore this elephant in the room. But the truth is that, for the past quarter of a century, Britain has been a petro-economy. In 1999, we were producing more oil than Iraq, Kuwait or Nigeria. The following year, we pumped out almost twice as much natural gas as Iran – a country with reserves that are the envy of the world.
The result is that while we are apt to attribute the sudden spurt in Britain's prosperity in the mid- to late-1980s to a deregulated and reinvigorated City, it owed far more to the massive windfall from the North Sea. Take a look at the numbers. In 1979, when Margaret Thatcher came to power, the amount Britain owed, as a nation, was £88.6 billion. In the subsequent six years, taxes from the North Sea (which had been pretty much non-existent previously) generated an incredible £52.4 billion.


This was no temporary windfall: last year, thanks to record oil prices, the Treasury had its largest ever haul from the North Sea, at £13 billion. This colossal sum equates to more than 3p on the basic rate of income tax – and it was thanks in great part to such revenue that Labour was able to sustain public spending in recent years without a drastic increase in interest rates or having to pass the extra costs on to consumers in the form of higher taxes.

sheffield_lad

http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/2013/04/thatcher-and-north-sea-oil-%E2%80%93-failure-invest-britain%E2%80%99s-future

Total North Sea Revenue: UK 1980-81 to 2010-11 in real terms (£2011)

sheffield_lad

Andy_WSM wrote: »

Oh gosh, that all got cut out years ago. 5 years of not having a pay rise has taken it's toll on the standard of living here.

BB - BT basic package, about £10 a month. - Need this as I work from home.

Mob - SIM only, no contract, old iPhone, £12.50 per month.

SKY - You must be joking, I don't even have a TV Aerial / Freeview and hence a TV Licence any more.

Do I consider £120 a month expensive? Yes I do! It's about 10% of what I take home

Well done! If only many others had your resolve.

My Sky package (with calls), works out around £60per month inc BB

2x mob contracts = £25

So £85 all in for bb & mobs

compared to £95 for my gas & lecci (well insulated )

I know which I consider better value I can do without TV I can't go without fuel.