Term time holiday fine question.

Mojisola

xxlouisexx56 wrote: »

We've booked a holiday for next may/June departing on the tues in half term.

I am hoping our holiday will be approved under the special circumstances.

I think a lot of people will still take holidays that suit them but will add the cost of the fine into the cost of the holiday.

There are going to be some very upset separated parents when one parent takes the children away on holiday and the other also gets fined.

FBaby

Spendless wrote: »

I had exactly the same letter from son's academy about it as I did from daughter's Junior school (foundation school). The ruling is from the Government not the council. The only difference was daughter's school said 'we have new rules from Sept and they apply with immediate effect. This was April/May time. Son's school sent out the same letter several weeks after and said if you apply for a hol within the next so long (10 days-ish) we will apply our current rules to it for a hol taken in the next academic year.

Thanks for clarifying my mistake, although interestingly, no letter has yet been sent to that effect to parents so far. Has all posters received letters from their school?

FBaby

I am hoping our holiday will be approved under the special circumstances.

If it is on the basis that shool holidays are too busy for your daughter, I wouldn't be sure as surely they could say that you could chose a destination that are not full of children. There are many places in Europe that don't burst with kids during school holiday. We went to the South coast of Crete last year the two last week of August and hardly encountered any children at all. We rented a a villa and enjoyed deserted beaches. We too were desperate to avoid destinations full of young children, for different reasons.

FBaby

So I read that as per absence, so 2 days or 2 weeks, it would be the same fine is that right peachy?

Or more outrageously, I could have been fine the same amount when I took my kids out of school at 1am on a Friday to have enough time to travel to the airport to get our evening flight, hence a total of missing 2:10 hours of end of term school time, than if I had taken than out for 1 month....

This is a total utter farce and just a plain insult to parents...

merlin1

FBaby wrote: »

Or more outrageously, I could have been fine the same amount when I took my kids out of school at 1am on a Friday to have enough time to travel to the airport to get our evening flight, hence a total of missing 2:10 hours of end of term school time, than if I had taken than out for 1 month....

This is a total utter farce and just a plain insult to parents...

Absolutely! I think the authorities have underestimated exactly how many parents will argue and appeal any fines imposed, and it will end up costing a whole lot more in the long run. Aside from the points already raised in this thread there will be many more due to other circumstances i think. If the authorities cant decide what is exceptional what hope have the rest of us got!

And yes I got a letter during the last week of term before the summer hols started

Guest101

peachyprice wrote: »

Yes, they are. Courts can give entites status to be able to issue fines, such as the police can. LEA's have been granted this status.

Thats not a fine, thats an out of court settlement. Only the court can fine someone. Seriously i wonder why people dont do more research

peachyprice

Guest101 wrote: »

Thats not a fine, thats an out of court settlement. Only the court can fine someone. Seriously i wonder why people dont do more research

Jesus, talk about semantics.

OK, it's a Penalty Notice (aka a fine) authorised by the court, just the same as a police issued parking fine that is actually a penalty notice, and a speeding fine, which is actually a penalty notice and a fine for littering that is a Penalty Notice.

I wonder why people don't do more research too. You'd think that people would know that a fine is the same as a penalty notice, but hey ho.

An out of court settlement is something else entirely.

de_g.

merlin1 wrote: »

Absolutely! I think the authorities have underestimated exactly how many parents will argue and appeal any fines imposed, and it will end up costing a whole lot more in the long run. Aside from the points already raised in this thread there will be many more due to other circumstances i think. If the authorities cant decide what is exceptional what hope have the rest of us got!

And yes I got a letter during the last week of term before the summer hols started

I don't think there is any suggestion that fines are intended to be anything other than punitive, so it really makes little difference whether it ends up costing LAs and Academies to administer.

I think there will gradually be a consensus form within LA areas about what constitutes exceptional circumstances - and we'll probably see greater use of the codes for approved education activities because they don't show in a school's stats as an absence. Remember, schools have government-set floor targets for attendance, and falling below that will rapidly attract the attention of Ofsted.

merlin1

de_g. wrote: »

I don't think there is any suggestion that fines are intended to be anything other than punitive, so it really makes little difference whether it ends up costing LAs and Academies to administer.

I think there will gradually be a consensus form within LA areas about what constitutes exceptional circumstances - and we'll probably see greater use of the codes for approved education activities because they don't show in a school's stats as an absence. Remember, schools have government-set floor targets for attendance, and falling below that will rapidly attract the attention of Ofsted.

I hope you're right on both of your points there de g. I most likely will pay any fine handed to me for the 2/3 days next September as it's not exceptional circumstances - more a c*up by my parents!

I do feel however, that there will be parents that end up punished for reasons beyond their control and at the whim of the school's own interpretation of these new rules. The amendments do say its up to the head how long for each exceptional absence permission will be given, but I really cant see a one size fits all here and there'll be anomalies surely.

I guess time will tell, and greater communication, consensus and clarification will, as you say, come with time

Guest101

peachyprice wrote: »

Jesus, talk about semantics.

OK, it's a Penalty Notice (aka a fine) authorised by the court, just the same as a police issued parking fine that is actually a penalty notice, and a speeding fine, which is actually a penalty notice and a fine for littering that is a Penalty Notice.

I wonder why people don't do more research too. You'd think that people would know that a fine is the same as a penalty notice, but hey ho.

An out of court settlement is something else entirely.

Not at all, a penalty charge notice is exactly that, an out of court settlement, it is pleading guilty to the offence and paying the proposed amount to avoid court.

A fine is what a court judgment is, completely different. As the court decides on guilt.

A Penalty charge notice is not a fine.

You want to give advice, give it correctly