Nice People Thread Part 9 - and so it continues

PasturesNew

lostinrates wrote: »

...and then see when they STOPPED talking too. ....

Oh dear... I'd fail on that point

michaels

One eye is very lazy which means even if it was fixed (it is also long sighted and astigmatic) my brain would still not process the images to any great extent (although it was originally thought the pathways were fixed after age 8 but recent research has suggested the brain may adapt when older - a great piece of research, they got people playing tertris where one eye could see one part of the screenand the other eye the other part). Because of this they also refrain from fixing the other dominent eye in case it went wrong as there is no second eye to fall back on. You wre quite close and I had my glasses on so I think my observations were probably valid....

My turn for a random question. Toilet seat fixings, normally you drop the bolts through two holes in the bowl and screw on the plastic wingnuts from underneath. At the rented house we have one where the holes are not accessible from below because the bowl forms a continuous shroud, the seat hinges appear to instead screw in but the screws just rotate in both directions. How and I tighten the seat up or alternatively remove it and fit a replacement?

PasturesNew

Generali wrote: »

VLOOKUP I reckon followed by the IF function, assuming you're not going to use nested IF functions which are an abomination in the eyes of The Great Programmer. Pivot Tables are incredibly useful for crunching very large amounts of data which I rarely do but which our new employee will have to do a lot.

That's the function I've used most for the last 10 years. It's so easy to use. I did programming in two years of OU studies, of programming and advanced programming, so I know the "magic words" to quickly find the Excel function syntax I need and to then write it into the correct programme structure to produce the correct results... I'd then test any results n a newly constructed piece to ensure I was getting true results.

PasturesNew

lostinrates wrote: »

The thing is Pastures, that's ok. you are just like you. :T

I'm not just like them either most of the time and I'm happy about that. .

Its funny, because 'they' are often trying to be different in 'whacky' and 'cool' ways. Which means they are often doing the same things as each other anyway. I get a little surprised because the things they do to be different often end up being what I am doing anyway and then I feel a bit out of kilter. I missed the cupcake vibe thankfully.

The beat of your own drum is a good thing, Other people walk around and sometimes their rhythms compliment which is great, other times, playing solo is powerful too.

The trouble is ... it's OK to be anything one wants to be ... but if you need a job and can't leap through the hoops then it's annoying.

And sometimes their questions aren't asking the right question - you'd know the answer if they'd known how to ask the question correctly.

Generali

PasturesNew wrote: »

I'd not be able to answer those questions easily .... as there are many answers so I'd need to think about it. Do you want a pivot table, or a chart? What sort of chart?

I think the best thing to do would have been to compile an Excel test paper for them to do it, not talk about it.

I hate open questions - never sure what sort of answer's expected, so you can have the right answer, but didn't know that's what they wanted.

I "don't do" open questions at all....

I'm not going to spend half a day writing an Excel test paper, ever! If that makes the selection process unfair, too bad. Life's not fair.

PasturesNew

I've actually been using Excel since it was v4 nearly 20 years ago. The trouble with Excel is that every job requires different functions to be used. Some people wander off into programming it. It's difficult to know, without sight, which functions would be best for any particular task - and whether a knowledge/ability of programming it would be useful or crucial.

Excel programming therefore often requires a higher level of understanding of mathematics/statistics as the problems being solved are harder than simple Excel lookups/etc.... and often the interviewers have no idea of the actual Excel complexity of the tasks involved, so can't communicate that at interview.

I know what I know... and I know what I don't know/don't want to touch.

It's like, say, writing. If you're asked if you can write in English, the answer might be "yes".... but if you then get hired and discover that the job is to write in English about theoretical physics and its effects on agriculural advances in the last 30 years you might suddenly go "ooooh ....." and head for the door.

Generali

PasturesNew wrote: »

I've actually been using Excel since it was v4 nearly 20 years ago. The trouble with Excel is that every job requires different functions to be used. Some people wander off into programming it. It's difficult to know, without sight, which functions would be best for any particular task - and whether a knowledge/ability of programming it would be useful or crucial.

Excel programming therefore often requires a higher level of understanding of mathematics/statistics as the problems being solved are harder than simple Excel lookups/etc.... and often the interviewers have no idea of the actual Excel complexity of the tasks involved, so can't communicate that at interview.

I know what I know... and I know what I don't know/don't want to touch.

It's like, say, writing. If you're asked if you can write in English, the answer might be "yes".... but if you then get hired and discover that the job is to write in English about theoretical physics and its effects on agriculural advances in the last 30 years you might suddenly go "ooooh ....." and head for the door.

I admit I have had to go away and Google an answer a candidate gave. He's doing a second Masters degree in some Statistical thing. He didn't get the job as he was never going to pass the final test. He would also have been bored out of his mind in 5 minutes.

PasturesNew

Generali wrote: »

I'm not going to spend half a day writing an Excel test paper, ever! If that makes the selection process unfair, too bad. Life's not fair.

It doesn't have to be big or hard. You can probably even find a free online one for them to do.

Or, just give them 12 lines and get them to perform four functions. Get them to add sheets that sum and average the amounts, then a sheet that only provides results where column C has values greater than 7 and column E contains the name "John" and turn the data on that sheet into a pi chart.

Also, different versions of Excel use different functions. I've got Excel 2003, for example. That doesn't mean I couldn't know the answers, but where functions are found, or shortcuts built in will change from version to version. e.g. in more modern versions there are built in functions to perform all sorts of basic data sorts and analysis that are straight forward to use, but if you've not seen a modern version you'd never be able to name them at interview.

Another way might be to target people with specific level of qualifications in it. e.g. if you asked for an ECDL in Excel I'd apply, even though I haven't got that - as I've taught at that level before. But, it'd put off the blaggers. And, the syllabus is openly available so you'd know what they should be able to do.

Generali

PasturesNew wrote: »

It doesn't have to be big or hard. You can probably even find a free online one for them to do.

Or, just give them 12 lines and get them to perform four functions. Get them to add sheets that sum and average the amounts, then a sheet that only provides results where column C has values greater than 7 and column E contains the name "John" and turn the data on that sheet into a pi chart.

It's simply not worth the effort. A point that people often miss about business is that doing the very best is rarely worth it. Good enough is good enough 99% of the time.

PasturesNew

Generali wrote: »

I admit I have had to go away and Google an answer a candidate gave. He's doing a second Masters degree in some Statistical thing. He didn't get the job as he was never going to pass the final test. He would also have been bored out of his mind in 5 minutes.

What was the final test?
Why would you assume he'd be bored? Numbers are lovely..... it's nice to just sit and do data analysis for weeks on end to produce results.

I've had a lot of data analysis jobs using various databases and Excel.... love it.