Identity theft by family member

tinkerbell28

Oh and fwiw, the police don't do much. You report it, they give a crime reference, you don't need to say you know who did it.

The companies remove the information. I don't know what they do, claim on insurance, or find the fraudster themselves and track them down for payment.

Police phone a couple of months later and see how it's going, then when you say your credit file is clear. They don't persue it.

spacey2012

If you can not Grasp the very basic principle that WONGA have been defrauded not your mum, you can not help, sorry but you won't.
They know your brother is responsible = they know your mother did not take out the Loans.
They will gladly allow her to create joinder with them and start paying them off.
But if they are aware of fraud and it is them who has suffered the loss they are the victim.

jacques_chirac

tinkerbell28 wrote: »

Oh and fwiw, the police don't do much. You report it, they give a crime reference, you don't need to say you know who did it.

The companies remove the information. I don't know what they do, claim on insurance, or find the fraudster themselves and track them down for payment.

Police phone a couple of months later and see how it's going, then when you say your credit file is clear. They don't persue it.

Lying to the police is not advisable - it is standard for them to ask if they know who may have committed the fraud, to deny any knowledge when you do know could lead to some very difficult questions later on.

I agree that not all identity fraud cases are investigated, but some are, especially if the lender pushes for it to happen. Your suggested course of action has the potential to end in tears.

tinkerbell28

jacques_chirac wrote: »

Lying to the police is not advisable - it is standard for them to ask if they know who may have committed the fraud, to deny any knowledge when you do know could lead to some very difficult questions later on.

I agree that not all identity fraud cases are investigated, but some are, especially if the lender pushes for it to happen. Your suggested course of action has the potential to end in tears.

The police don't always ask actually. They just log it and crime reference done. Not much effort at all.

They don't pursue it on the whole, only if the creditor pushes, most don't.

How do I know, personal experience. I should've said that.

So my course of action doesn't mean it will end in tears, how silly.

It is the only way op's mum will get her credit file clean and the debts removed. In MY experience police don't even ask if they know who did it. The police really cannot be bothered with id theft on a small scale. They certainly wouldn't be coming after her for saying she doesn't know if asked. Talk about dramatics.

ValHaller

ap1988 wrote: »

what you said was irrelevent to my orginal post and your tryng to pass judgement on what is already a difficult situation.
your opinion on how i will impact the situation is laughable as you have no idea what my background is.
if you notice i also thanked the second person to respond so feel free not to comment if its not constructive.

Sorry, your attitude to the comments is wrong.

You need to understand that the victim is Wonga, albeit they are despicable cretins at best.

Once you understand that, you can then see that your mother is 'co-lateral damage'.

The conventional advice is for your mother to report the matter to the police - however as she is not the victim, I do not see that it is her place to do this - I think it is for Wonga to do.

Now, in order for Wonga to do this, your mother needs to tell Wonga everything she knows about the situation and be prepared to pursue a complaint right to the top and take Wonga to court for a declaration that she owes them nothing. It is probably going to be 10 times harder than reporting to the police.

But either way, the whole story as far as it is known of your brother's involvement has to be told. Either your brother is shopped and risks facing the music or your mother does not get her mortgage.

tinkerbell28

What happens is in my experience. With ID theft.

Credit companies ask you to report it as a crime and get a crime number.

They won't do ANYTHING without you doing this as everyone would say their credit cards were fraud, or those with less scruples. So this shows that you mean business and initially it is a crime against you. You are incurring costs/fines/consequential losses/debt. As far as the creditors are concerned you owe them money and it is a civil matter as to why you won't pay. Until it is reported as a crime.

You phone up 101, who say oh ok, fraudulent activity on credit file, here is your crime reference number. That is literally it.

You phone up the companies, who then pass this onto their fraud team. Who proceed to remove the debt from your name. They have some kind of insurances for this, I was lead to believe, but the fraud team do have ways and means of tracking people if they want. For example they may use their own address, bank details, etc, etc.

Police don't bother at all. Even for 10x more than this, even when they know the exact address goods, etc were going to. As once it is off your credit file and reported as fraud. As val haler says, you are no longer a victim, it's the lenders.

The police then don't care what you know, who you know and that fraud has been committed.They are not interested. It is then down to wonga or whoever to report if they choose to as they are the victims. Most of the time they don't.

Either way, she needs to report it to the police. IF she wants a clean credit file, a mortgage and not to be chased for thousands. They will NOT transfer credit accounts. That I can guarantee.

ILW

What has brother got to say for himself?

ValHaller

tinkerbell28 wrote: »

What happens is in my experience. With ID theft.

Credit companies ask you to report it as a crime and get a crime number.

They won't do ANYTHING without you doing this as everyone would say their credit cards were fraud, or those with less scruples. So this shows that you mean business and initially it is a crime against you. You are incurring costs/fines/consequential losses/debt. As far as the creditors are concerned you owe them money and it is a civil matter as to why you won't pay. Until it is reported as a crime.

You phone up 101, who say oh ok, fraudulent activity on credit file, here is your crime reference number. That is literally it.

It does discourage people saying their credit cards were fraud, because they are putting their necks on the line for 'wasting police time' - although the police waste enough of their own time already

Donna89 wrote: »

All this talk of victim-hood is rather irksome. What about just trying to get the best outcome without scorching your brother:

- it seems unlikely that debt companies will want to transfer into your brothers dead end account but YOU SHOULD TRY HARD to do so.

- You could take the loan out in your name, on your mums behalf.

Even though your brother has done you wrong, calling the police should always be a last resort cosidering their poor track record and the fact in their current form that they do not serve the people, they are corrupt.

So keep it in the family and bite the bullet I say. It's a shame your brother is like that. It's a shame you didnt see it coming!

Donna, we could have an interesting off topic discussion about which is more reprehensible, Pay Day Loan companies or the police. But the brother is far more despicable than either.

Mum losing a mortgage is a heavy price to pay for his fraud - and I don't think that taking out a loan to pay off Wonga is going to do the least little thing to repair Mum's credit record - it is going to look like a continuation of the fraud as damage limitation once you are caught out. Even going to the police after attempting this is far less likely to be successful than dong it is the first place.

caffsean

I too have been a victim of fraud via Wonga, they wanted a crime ref no etc before they would do anything for me. You need to call action-fraud as the police won't do anything and only tell you to call them - explain that on checking your mothers credit report you have seen that someone has taken out a loan in her name, she's not received the money etc.

Wonga then take the action-fraud ref no from you, check if they paid the money into your mothers account (which you've said they didn't) and look at where they're supposed to be taking the payments back from (which again I'm assuming is not from your mothers account or you'd have noticed the money going prior to checking the credit report) - I'm also guessing that your brother must have applied online or wonga would have had to get your mothers permission etc over the phone to discuss it all with him. As for Wonga being victims I must admit that I do find it hard to sympathise with them, they do little or no id checks, no address checks and then pay the money into a different account to that of the person supposedly applying and repaying it!

Unless your brother has admitted that he's done this or you've seen his bank statements to confirm he's received the payments from Wonga you don't actually have any proof that it's him and so maybe it may be better to take the approach "ask me no questions and I'll tell you no lies" (they didn't ask me if I had any idea who it was - but then again I had not idea who'd used my details to be fair) ultimately it's up to your mother and her conscience - I know as a parent myself I'd find it a very difficult decision to "shop" my own kid for something like this but again it depends on the circumstances etc etc.

I would however make sure that your brother is aware of exactly what is going on and that it's all been reported to the "police" and they are investigating it fully etc, you don't need to tell him that you suspect it was him but with any luck this'll put the wind up him and hopefully kick him into dealing with his debt issues etc if he thinks the police might come knocking.

matttye

spacey2012 wrote: »

Listen, if your mum did not make these applications, the people that have lost the money are the victims.

They're both victims. I'm sure we've been through this before...

Mother's identity has been stolen and she's now been put into an impossible situation. She is as much a victim as Wonga. She may not have lost anything financially at the moment, but she could do if she is pursued for the debt.