After the Work Programme

sensibleadvice

AP007 wrote: »

That's not me is it? :eek:

Yup.............

AP007

sensibleadvice wrote: »

Yup.............

Very odd thing o say that since you haven't seen my CV which no doubt is crap and I am must be totally worthless and unemployable since I don't have a job.

sensibleadvice

Chester666666 wrote: »

Most is basic to people but you tend to be rude about the unemployed and your persona online is smug and patronising
Dunno you in the r/w so don't be upset by my comments

Yet some just don't appear to grasp the basics. In RW I admire honesty, integrity, work ethic and good attitude. With regards to jobs if they've got those qualities, I'd give most a foot on the ladder when there's a position available. If not then no problem giving feedback accordingly. I don't really see that as smug or patronising. Not upset, it's only a forum.

OleGunnar

sensibleadvice wrote: »

That's all well and good you saying all that but you've still failed to acknowledge why there has been 9 months of prior job seeking and not finding. You're right I don't know you but have you considered cleaning jobs? packing? part time? agencies? Because TBH, if it were me job seeking with those quals I'd be doing ujm because it's a requirement but I'd sure as heck be looking elsewhere for opportunities. Yes, been there done that btw.

You're right I don't know you but you appear articulate enough to evidence what is expected by the advisors such that the demonising and vindictive points are moot.

Incidentally, was the training 1-1?

1-1? Ah ha ha, you genuinely have no idea, do you?
No, it was a class of approx 20 people of different backgrounds and experience being taught by 2 people. Some where older and needed the computer training, hence why I said I acknowledge the course is good for some. Just not me, nor was I the only one.

Incidentally one tutor repeatedly went to the side of the room to answer the phone to accept the details for the next intake of people. When I was there I heard them say "sorry, next two months are fully booked, next is after Xmas". You do the maths.

You sidestepped what I was asking. Was that course pointless in my circumstances? Do you think at best it's a test or in reality punitive in nature for me?


Thank you for commentating on my English. Funnily enough last week I had an assessment for another, different course. The assessment was a basic English test and my details. Guess what, I scored full marks in a very quick time. That was another £4 day ticket I got refunded from the Job Centre for a 15 minute interview/ test. Which could have had the same outcome had they spent 30 seconds talking to me on the phone/ reading my CV.

Are you angry at the inefficiency of another £4 refund to me and what ever fee the dude who saw me is getting?


You misunderstand me in regard to UJM. My point was I was sent to do a course on how to use UJM/ basic computer after I'd been using it for 9 months, something the Job Center who referred me are aware of. I look on Reed, UJM, CV Library, the local paper, the regional local paper etc etc etc. Do you really want me to list them all? This is evidenced in my job log, though when I first saw the adviser I overwhelmed him with paper printouts of applications so scared was I that he needed irrefutable evidence. Funnily enough he now accepts the job log with reference numbers, employer names etc.

You also wrongly assume other things- this week I have applied for admin, data entry, basic office work, warehouse, retail, customer service call centre, inbound call centre amongst others. I have applied to work on the Manchester Wheel, the temporary ice rink they made locally at Xmas and selling tickets at the Coronation Street box office. Part time, temporary yes to both- my minimum requirement is 15 hours at NMW so I can pay to get to work and be better off than the £70 dole.

The odd cleaner job I see always, always states at least one of the following: requires own transport, requires experience, requires recent/ upto date checkable history and references. I fail the first two and the third is sketchy at best. That said I have applied at Travelodge within the last month or so.

Admittedly it's predominately admin focused but I do sector specific searches and a search for every job in a 10 mile radius. Reed is better than UJM for this as it lets you specify a salary and doesn't have the fake ads that populate the Government site, Daily, every week day and normally Sunday morning I look. No, I didn't look on Xmas Day nor Boxing day.


I also do voluntary conservation work that was sourced by me and done under my own steam and not through duress. Initially the goal was a recent reference and to show commitment and dependability but it's something I actually enjoy and find beneficial.



I at no point have expressed that I am targeted by vindictive JC advisers. Reread what I said. I feel they are strict, sanction, refer to inadequate courses and the work programme, enforce boneheaded daily signing to some not necessarily because they want to or think it's beneficial but because the rules, targets and legislation say they must. The villain is the DWP and IDS.


Have you any opinion or knowledge of Universal Credit?

imatt

sensibleadvice wrote: »

I'm not embarrassed to be in work.

Why are WP clients forgotten? What are they doing in those months on end...and the conveniently forgotten months prior to WP? Jobseeking perhaps? Yep done that, got the jobs while some keep on blaming spivs and sociopaths.

No, but you SHOULD be embarrassed by your 'arguments'.


Again, you miss the point. Can you not read? I have explained why WP clients are forgotten. No doubt you are happy to see billions of £ wasted to prove an ideological point.

What are they doing in those months on end? Some do find work, many do not. Many who find work do so only for a few weeks or months and are thus back on the WP. Pretty much the same as when attending the Job Centre as the WP is no better results wise.

You smugly state you never claimed benefits. Good for you. Which means you have no idea how the WP operates. So cannot reasonably make any comments with any knowledge whatsoever.

Which begs the questions.

Why the hell do you spend so much of your time here? Do you have nothing better to do? Are you THAT lonely? Are you unhappy in your own job? Why not get on with your own life? You seem obsessed with telling people how to conduct themselves. And yet you do this with a paucity of knowledge.

Debating with you is worse than dealing with a five year old as you seem to repeat yourself over and over again.

It is abundantly clear you are coming at this thread from apposition of absolute ignorance.


P.S. I did email Emma Harrison about her disgrace of a company. And yes I did get a reply. I'll PM it to anyone interested. Her response unsurprisingly was similar to sensibleadvices.

sensibleadvice

AP007 wrote: »

Very odd thing o say that since you haven't seen my CV which no doubt is crap and I am must be totally worthless and unemployable since I don't have a job.

I've seen your posts and they appear to generally show you're trying to find work, put the hours in, probably more than required, have attention to detail, appear methodical... that's my take, sorry if I got that wrong.

AP007

sensibleadvice wrote: »

I've seen your posts and they appear to generally show you're trying to find work, put the hours in, probably more than required, have attention to detail, appear methodical... that's my take, sorry if I got that wrong.

That's the only thing/s you seem to have right

That doesn't show on a CV however.

No one believes you when you say you look for an apply for jobs non stop.

melysion

sensibleadvice wrote: »

The first example was factual and to the point. Read back on the posts and you might understand why I make no apology for the tone.

The second two were not patronising, look elsewhere, you'll see I've said I'd offer an interview to that poster. However others pick up on constructive points and spin it right around to the system, advisors etc. It's no wonder advisors are inclined to take a stern approach when faced with this kind of mentality.

I'm sure you'll be able to answer without diverting to something else that's poor value, a common tactic used...so, if somethings not good value why should there be a problem raising such a fact?

You misunderstand. I didn't say your other two examples were patronising. I thought they were actually decent posts. What I meant was that some of your other posts (i.e. ones you haven't highlighted) have been patronising. Apologies for not making that clear.

Sadly, I see that you haven't taken what I have said on board at all (going by your consequent replies to other people) so - rather than waste my breath - I'll now leave this one well alone

OleGunnar

sensibleadvice wrote: »

I'm not embarrassed to be in work.

Why are WP clients forgotten? What are they doing in those months on end...and the conveniently forgotten months prior to WP? Jobseeking perhaps? Yep done that, got the jobs while some keep on blaming spivs and sociopaths.

Again this is another misconception on your part. In this instance it's not necessarily your fault. Certain things are the same at every Job Center. Legislation, naturally is one, that you must actively seek work, that you sign a deceleration every fortnight.

However there are massive differences in region to region, even Job Centre to Job Centre. The differences can be huge. This includes the Work Programme, perhaps because it's administered by several bodies such as Serco and then outsourced from them to smaller companies.

On my Work Programme I was parked I felt. Did this mean I had no contact? No. Some people aren't seen for months on end. I had monthly/ three weekly meetings where they'd spend 5 minutes booking the next interview and making a cursory glance at the Job log. I had to attend regular (varied between once weekly and fortnightly, seemingly changed at random) Job Clubs. This is theoretically supervised Job search.

A two hour round trip to do what I do at home (search the internet for jobs). Throw in endless CV courses, how not to turn up !!!!ed at interview courses at that was pretty much the sum total of their tailored, specialist help. This was pretty much my experience. Is it because they thought I was useless or helpless? Na, they said I was doing the right things and keep going. Once admitted they struggled under the work load of seeing so many people and feeling sorry they couldn't do more.

In the middle was a months mandatory work placement, though this too was farcical in my situation. The idiots couldn't source a placement for many so held 9-3 school like sessions where we made paper bridges, discussed how football shirts aren't suitable interview attire and rejigged CVs. For the 87th time.

The interesting thing, and nothing new, is I must have had over ten different Work Programme advisers. Did they all find better jobs or is the churn rate so high because it's a !!!!, thankless job with such a high caseload? They too work on minimal resources despite their company bosses creaming literally millions from the Government for the specialist help.

Guess what, I claimed back travel expenses too, every time. What a monumental waste.

Chester666666

Accusing every member of this forum as moaning etc doesn't help either

You catch more flies with honey than you do with vinegar.