Landlord taking deposit dispute to County Court

thesaint

angrypirate wrote: »

No. The agent refused to use the ADR.

The OP originally said the agent had refused the DPS adjudication service, and then the next thing he knew, he had court papers served on him.

MagnumBI wrote: »

It was the landlord who made a claim for the Deposit via DPS, I refused and was looking forward to going to DPS adjudication, however the landlord, as is his right, has persisted with taking me to Court instead.

The story then changed, as he then said that the agent offered mediation before any court papers were served, he refused the mediation, and then was served. See the difference?

MagnumBI wrote: »

Their most recent letter advised that because I disputed their deposit claim via DPS, that County Court action would be lodged within 3 days of the date of the letter, although in reality, they appear to have taken 10. They did make offer of a "sit down" to discuss the matter, however I refused, preffering the matter be resolved in writing, that is when I received the court papers.

The judge will look at if every opportunity to avoid court had been made.
It hadn't.

spacey2012

The landlords failure to comply with pre-action protocol will see his case last all of 30 seconds.
At a county court hearing the district will ask if all are happy to proceed.
This is where you raise any objections, at this stage you should answer along the lines, with all due respects your honour before agreeing to proceed can we examine the conduct of the plaintiff in failing to adhere to the correct procedures and failing to issue any letter before action or any bill or invoice.
The judge will then either dismiss your challenge or explore the argument.
If he/ she agrees his case is struck out in full at that point.

Once you agree to continue and do not raise any legal arguments, you accept the case and can only defend.
So expect the question and have the ammo ready.

MagnumBI

thesaint wrote: »

The OP originally said the agent had refused the DPS adjudication service, and then the next thing he knew, he had court papers served on him.



The story then changed, as he then said that the agent offered mediation before any court papers were served, he refused the mediation, and then was served. See the difference?



The judge will look at if every opportunity to avoid court had been made.
It hadn't.

To he clear one more time, the order of events were as follows:

1. The agent stated their intention to use DPS to claim the deposit, I encouraged this as I was very happy to proceed to ADR.

2. I recieved the agents claim from the DPS for the full deposit, I denied I owed them anything and gave consent that we proceed to ADR.

3. The agent refused ADR and wrote to me stating if I didn't visit their office in 3 days, they would commence County Court Action. I did refuse, stating I wished correspondence remain in writing.
,
4. I then received the Court Claim form.

While I'm sure it won't look great that I didn't wish to sit down with them, I think I agree that the agents refusual to use ADR before that, will look equally bad.

Voyager2002

thesaint wrote: »

Read again. The agent offered mediation. The tenant refused.

I disagree. The landlord/agent refused to use the usual mediation service, and failed to provide adequate documentation to justify the claim. The offer of a face-to-face meeting is not a substitute for receipts (or even a detailed breakdown of the amount supposedly claimed). Under such circumstances, the meeting would have been an occasion to brow-beat the tenant and perhaps trick him into admissions that he need not have made.

I think that the court is likely to find for the tenant, and leave the landlord to pay the costs.

angrypirate

thesaint wrote: »

The OP originally said the agent had refused the DPS adjudication service, and then the next thing he knew, he had court papers served on him.



The story then changed, as he then said that the agent offered mediation before any court papers were served, he refused the mediation, and then was served. See the difference?



The judge will look at if every opportunity to avoid court had been made.
It hadn't.

Back to my previous question, are you a LL? You appear to be looking at this with rose tinted glasses.

RAS

I think 3 days to sort it in the office is unreasonable. A couple of weeks would be acceptable.

Voyager2002

MagnumBI wrote: »

SNIP

While I'm sure it won't look great that I didn't wish to sit down with them, I think I agree that the agents refusual to use ADR before that, will look equally bad.

No, you acted reasonably. You had asked for evidence to justify the amounts that you were being claimed, and they failed to provide this. They should have given you a reasonable opportunity to examine details of their costs (a detailed breakdown of the different forms of damage, receipts for cleaning costs and perhaps alternative quotations for work undertaken as evidence that the costs were reasonable) before beginning a process of negotiation. They failed to provide this documentation. And remember that the agent acts for the landlord, and so the proposed meeting would have been a negotiation session rather than mediation with an independent person.

angrypirate

MagnumBI wrote: »

To he clear one more time, the order of events were as follows:

1. The agent stated their intention to use DPS to claim the deposit, I encouraged this as I was very happy to proceed to ADR.

2. I recieved the agents claim from the DPS for the full deposit, I denied I owed them anything and gave consent that we proceed to ADR.

3. The agent refused ADR and wrote to me stating if I didn't visit their office in 3 days, they would commence County Court Action. I did refuse, stating I wished correspondence remain in writing.
,
4. I then received the Court Claim form.

While I'm sure it won't look great that I didn't wish to sit down with them, I think I agree that the agents refusual to use ADR before that, will look equally bad.

These three things are in your favour.
1. The agent refused to use the ADR.
2. The agent has not given you reasonable time to discuss this. For someone working full time this is not a reasonable timeframe.
3. Nothing wrong with wanting to keep it official and in writing. This is how the ADR do it. I would say that it suggests the LL / LA has something to hide. In fact, a lot of mediation that doesnt reach court is often done formally in writing.

I would suggest writing a letter to the LA with a copy going to the LL saying that ideally you would like to save both yourself and them the time and effort of going to court and that ideally you wish to resolve this beforehand, preferably by use of the ADR or failing that directly in writing. Request a breakdown of all costs and re-affirm your position that you have no signed checkin or check out inventory and that you are aware that someone was living there before you as there is evidence of it on the electoral register. It may also be worth questioning why the difference in claim, as they first only tried to claim the value of the deposit.

At no point offer any amount of money. With no check in or check out inventory and with proof that someone lived there before you did (so it was not brand new) I would say your LL and LA are pretty amateurish. It looks like they have a very thin case to even retain a portion of your deposit.

angrypirate

Oh, I forgot to add that make sure you keep a copy of this letter and proof of postage to show the court. That way if the LL / LA dont give you a break down of the cost and only show you it in court, the judge wont look favourably on them as it is apparent that they dont want to give you a chance of a defence.

thesaint

MagnumBI wrote: »

While I'm sure it won't look great that I didn't wish to sit down with them, I think I agree that the agents refusual to use ADR before that, will look equally bad.

I agree... to a point. But, they did then ask to sort it out before going to court. You refused, they then went to court 10 days later(i think this is what you said).

RAS wrote: »

I think 3 days to sort it in the office is unreasonable. A couple of weeks would be acceptable.

How about 10 days?