revert the pension age to 60/65

Pollycat

mumps wrote: »

So bar staff don't matter? Or is it just if you want to do something then it is OK?

You just don't get the point I'm making do you? <sighs>

There are some jobs (yes, including bar staff) that have always been weekend (and late night) jobs.

We were talking about (or at least I thought we were) the fairly recent opening of retail outlets on Sundays.

So it has nothing to do with my attitude to bar staff - which, incidentally, you have got very wrong.

mumps wrote: »

Well HMRC don't call us a small organisation but I guess they know nothing compared to you. I think you will find lots of very large organisations don't need to advertise jobs but we will all accept the word of Pollycat who obviously knows better.

Ooooh, you sound a bit cross. :rotfl:

We must be talking about different types of organisations then because in the business I was in, jobs were advertised as there were probably a number of excellent candidates, as opposed to a 'Hey, Mumps, my mate fancies a job.' 'OK, tell her to start tomorrow' type of place.

margaretclare

redbuzzard wrote: »

I seem to have started an argument with my nostalgia attack.

It's not an argument, just a point of view. I simply lament that modern life should be better for the mass of people than it is, given the tremendous increase in productivity of the last 40 years.

We should have been able to translate that into more leisure and time to live, learn and socialise, not work, shop and eat 7 days a week.

Of course, the culprit is the market economy, which is extremely good at improving efficiency and generating wealth, but very bad at sharing it out. Left unshackled, it will always keep the mass of workers poor and enrich the owners of capital.

Unfortunately, like democracy, it seems to be the worst system there is, except for all the others that have been tried.

I agree with all the above, and I think the recent arguments have descended to trivial levels. Whoever buys a pair of socks on a Sunday - well, if you go to some of the Scottish islands, as we did recently, they do still keep to this kind of a rest day one day a week kind of idea. We weren't there on a Sunday, but, for example, on the island of Raasay (population 150) there's a notice which says 'Please don't use these playing-fields on Sunday'. And women in Portree, Skye, turning up to Sunday evening church dressed as if for the Queen's garden party with what I'd call 'wedding' hats.

OldBeanz

My wife works half a day early on a Sunday which was the first job she took up after maternity leave.
By keeping this job and her full time job it will allow her to retire earlier than planned. School aged children, with music and sports, tie us to the house most weekends anyway and they are of the age that she is back before they are out of bed.
Shutting shops on a Sunday would be a further death knell for shops and bonus for internet based companies.
Live and let live.

rpc

OldBeanz wrote: »

Shutting shops on a Sunday would be a further death knell for shops and bonus for internet based companies.

Well clearly the internet should close on a Sunday too.

redbuzzard

rpc wrote: »

Well clearly the internet should close on a Sunday too.

Fair point from Beanz. Winding back the clock is never an option.

Looking down the other end of the telescope, with shopping going online, do we really need to have the shops open every day? We could rest at home and wait for the shopping to come to us...just being mischievous, don't bother to flame that comment!

I am ambivalent about the internet, but it just works so well for many things and I don't like shops any more now that personal, knowledgeable service has been designed out.

I have just received the Ocado delivery, which I much prefer to driving 20 minutes each way, trawling the shop to see where they hid the Marmite this week, then finding that the special offer I put on the list is sold out, failing the self service till test yet again, and that my car has been dinked.

I also love Amazon and ebay. I broke the glass on my phone last week. At the weekend I ordered a new screen, which arrived on Tuesday while I was out and I fitted it yesterday. I wouldn't even know where to go to buy one in person.

But it does dehumanise jobs. Working in a shop and interacting with customers must be better than night shifts in a chilly warehouse, and people spend far too much time already in their own little boxes watching TV and ignoring the world (to which can be added internet forumming...).

À chacun, son goût, as they say in Surrey.

N1AK

redbuzzard wrote: »

It's not an argument, just a point of view. I simply lament that modern life should be better for the mass of people than it is, given the tremendous increase in productivity of the last 40 years.

We should have been able to translate that into more leisure and time to live, learn and socialise, not work, shop and eat 7 days a week.

I'd have more leisure time if the shops were open for longer on Sunday so they weren't as rammed when I, from time to time, want shop on a Saturday or Sunday. Having shops open all the time doesn't mean you have to use them, unless you're seriously lacking in self-control and a shopping addict.

Nobody benefits from Sunday trading rules except the shops that are exempt from them. Everyone else is either unaffected or inconvenienced.

Fortunately is doesn't really bother me, those opposed to it are a shrinking and ageing demographic so, it'll change soon enough.

mumps

moneyistooshorttomention wrote: »

If someone intends to stick to Monday-Friday working then a whole swathe of jobs becomes unavailable at the outset that used to be possible.

I was about halfway through my worklife (in office jobs basically) when Sunday trading came in and I can recall my first thought wasn't "Oh goodie. I can shop on Sundays too now". It was "Darn...darn...darn...that's a whole load of jobs I could no longer ask for if I ever needed them" (ie because I was a Monday-Friday worker only and wasn't prepared to change that). Till then (and late night working and Bank Holiday working) I'd always had that little "security thing" in my head that I could get a shop job for a while if it was proving difficult to get an office job. That "security thing" went in one fell swoop then. So my chances of unemployment became much greater with just one change of law.

So because you might want to work in a shop one day do you think no one should be able to shop on a Sunday?

mumps

OldBeanz wrote: »

My wife works half a day early on a Sunday which was the first job she took up after maternity leave.
By keeping this job and her full time job it will allow her to retire earlier than planned. School aged children, with music and sports, tie us to the house most weekends anyway and they are of the age that she is back before they are out of bed.
Shutting shops on a Sunday would be a further death knell for shops and bonus for internet based companies.
Live and let live.

Well I respect her work ethic, I hope she gets a great retirement as it sounds like she will have really earned it.

mumps

Pollycat wrote: »

You just don't get the point I'm making do you? <sighs>

There are some jobs (yes, including bar staff) that have always been weekend (and late night) jobs.



.

I don't see the relevance of how long bars have been open on Sundays, if people think Sunday should be a family/leisure day why shouldn't all staff have that? Do you remember the Sunday licensing laws? They were a bit more restrictive than now, do you keep to the old times?

mumps

seven-day-weekend wrote: »

He works on the roast chicken counter.

He actually does not mind working Sundays. He gets more money for it and prefers a day off in the week, when everyone else is at work.

It does not affect our family life in the slightest. And the more roast chickens you buy off him, on a Sunday or otherwise, the better!

Sorry, I knew meat was involved. I know what he means about the day off in the week, much better for lots of activities. I do occasionally buy a Morrisons chicken but probably not his branch.

Bit off topic but is the flat purchase going ahead or are you still making up your mind?