Schools no longer allowed to authorise holidays

duchy

Naf wrote: »

Our oldest just had two weeks off to visit family in Holland. As far as we're concerned its part of his cultural education as my wife and all that side of the family are Dutch. We informed the school, didn't ask permission, and have no idea if they actually 'authorised' it or not.
I wouldn't take an actual holiday during term time - but its my decision, not the school or state's.

See this is one of the grey areas as far as I am concerned.
If the visit was for an important family event like a wedding (although unless you made them walk there and back two weeks seems excessive) then a few days off to attend might not be an issue but if it was "just" a family visit that could equally have happened in July or August -then I do think you should be fined. The kids have just had a holiday from school- a week back and then another two weeks off is disruptive to the child and the school.

Naf

sweetcheekz wrote: »

After all I imagine there are very few parents who are deliberately setting out to wreck their children's education,

I don't think any are out to do it deliberately; but I suspect there are some who don't appreciate the benefits of their own education (feel let down by the system blah blah etc.) and so don't see the necessity of ensuring their child is at school as much as possible.
This is the only reason I can think of for the government wanting to be so intrusive - I expect they believe there are many more of these parents than is, in fact, the case.

Lunar_Eclipse

seven-day-weekend wrote: »

It goes without saying that my husband would have given up time to help someone who had missed lessons due to something beyond their control. I remember him giving up almost a week of lunchtimes to help an 'A' level student, who'd had time off because her father had died, catch up with her coursework.

But just to go on holiday? Not a chance!

Whilst I don't disagree with the sentiment and clearly someone's father dying is an extreme case of an event which could have a significant detrimental effect on upcoming exam success, it's important to acknowledge that both of these scenarios were outside the child's control.

It is parents that take children on holiday and lots of children of secondary school age would be devastated by the potential academic consequences of being absent during term time. So I'd like to think your husband might not have taken such a blanket 'black & white' approach.

FBaby

Mojisola wrote: »

But not all children are as quick to learn as your daughter. Have you considered the impact on your daughter because other children were taken away on holiday and then struggled in class which meant that the progress of the whole class was affected?

It comes down to the teacher though? Surely they shouldn't penalise a whole class because of one child and therefore should continue her lesson as planned? It is the parent responsibility to insure the child catches up, not the teacher.

Maybe only the bright children with conscientious parents should be allowed term time holidays?

Of course not, that would be doing exactly the same thing, ie. putting children in the same basket.

My approach to it would be for Head/key teacher to assess individual request, and depending on year group, time of year, length of holiday, plans the parents have it place to catch-up and the ability of the child to do so, they should make a decision whether they approve it or not with their reasons why they believe it will damage the child's education/school. If the parent then choose to ignore this, they can be advised that they are likely to incur a fine.

Mojisola

FBaby wrote: »

It comes down to the teacher though? Surely they shouldn't penalise a whole class because of one child and therefore should continue her lesson as planned? It is the parent responsibility to insure the child catches up, not the teacher.

And if the parents don't do anything, what then? Stick the child in a corner and ignore him/her because this week's lessons are based on what the class covered while the child was on holiday and he/she can't understand or follow what's happening?

duchy

Um wasn't that the old system they've just got rid of ????? (FBaby's post)

duchy

Mojisola wrote: »

And if the parents don't do anything, what then? Stick the child in a corner and ignore him/her because this week's lessons are based on what the class covered while the child was on holiday and he/she can't understand or follow what's happening?

You make it sound like key concepts are covered just once . Most key concepts are taught in a very repetitive way to ensure all levels have "got it" so in most cases your concerns there wouldn't apply.

FBaby

Mojisola wrote: »

And if the parents don't do anything, what then? Stick the child in a corner and ignore him/her because this week's lessons are based on what the class covered while the child was on holiday and he/she can't understand or follow what's happening?

Send a note to the parents to say they have missed that lesson and if nothing is done to help at home, the child will struggle in the upcoming test? Could be a standard letter with only the part about the lesson left to fill in?

Parents can't expect to make decision against recommendation and then not accept the consequences of these decisions. It is not for the teacher to pick up their failings.

Lunar_Eclipse

Tiddlywinks wrote: »

Isn't this also about teaching our kids to respect the "rules of the game"?

Taking them out of school for a non-essential reason is giving them the message that their education comes second... Plus, this has a longer term message - that it is OK for them to ignore the rules.

Very poor parenting...

I think you're right, but I agree and disagree in equal measure to this thinking.

Firstly, we shouldn't automatically place all schools on a pedestal and believe that the rules of the game, or the way they act, are in everyone's best interests at all times. That's an insulting thought to any reasonably intelligent or caring parent.

As a parent, it's my responsibility to do the best for my children, within respectful boundaries of others. There isn't a teacher or Head on this planet that has the same vested interest in them.

So who has sufficient information to judge on the importance or detriment of non-essential leave? Life is an education, of which school is a part. You don't necessarily decrease the value of a school or someone's education by taking holidays during term time.

Lunar_Eclipse

notanewuser wrote: »

No child is forced into state education. If you want your children educated at no cost to you* then you have to follow the rules. If you want the freedom to go on holiday when you like then homeschool (which has financial consequences). The state isn't there to provide schooling for your children when you feel like sending them.

* I know there are other costs like uniforms and trips etc.

There are very few people who follow ALL the rules, ALL of the time. In anything. And lots of evidence that it's those who challenge the rules that move society forwards.

I think it's important to respect the rules, but not necessarily follow them all the time.

It's a two way street. Children who are a delight to teach, quick to learn and thus catch up, well presented, a credit to the school in academic/music/sporting success are not who these rules/fines are aimed at.

I might be a rebel at heart, but my children are as described above plus incredibly rule abiding (sheep.)