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FTBs first offer made - negotiation advice needed
pete96
Posts: 108 Forumite
Hi all,
Been a while since I was last on here posting. Me and my girlfriend, as the title suggests, are looking to by our first house. We had our 2nd viewing last night on a house we like and have made an offer in writing which has been rejected this morning. We would be really grateful for any advice on how to takle the negotiation process moving forward.
This is the house we have made an offer on:
88 Cowley Close
http://www.zoopla.co.uk/for-sale/details/28727947?tmad=c&tmcampid=44&utm_content=sale&utm_medium=email&utm_source=conf
2 bed semi with garage attached.
Asking price of £164,000.
Last sold for £142,500 on 2nd Dec 2005
We have done some research into house prices in the area/same close and have based our offer on the following 2 houses:
79 Cowley Close
http://www.zoopla.co.uk/property/79-cowley-close/southampton/so16-9we/22156170
2 bed terrace, sold for £140,000 in Feb 2013
110 Cowley Close
http://www.zoopla.co.uk/property/110-cowley-close/southampton/so16-9we/22156201
Pretty much the same house as 88 Cowley Close, only the garage has been converted into a dining room, it has a conservatory and the decor/finishing generally is in better condition.
Sold for £155,000 in May 2012
As said above, we made our offer in writing and went as follows:
"To whom it may concern,
Re: 88 Cowley Close, Southampton
Further to our viewings on 25th & 30th May 2013, we are pleased to be in a position to offer to purchase the freehold on the above property for £147,000 (one hundred and forty seven thousand pounds sterling). This offer is on the basis that the property is taken off the market upon acceptance of the offer and all future and current viewings are cancelled. The offer is also subject to survey and valuation.
Our offer reflects the current property market, the condition of the property and our strong position as prospective purchasers. Given that 88 Cowley Close is vacant at present, I trust our desire for a swift completion will recommend this offer to the vendor.
Position of Purchasers
We can confirm that we are first-time buyers and therefore in a chain-free position. Our finances are in place and a mortgage agreement in principle can be provided if required. We would look to instruct a solicitor to act on our behalf in any property purchase immediately upon acceptance of the offer. As a result we would be able to complete a sale quickly.
Property Market
As you are no doubt aware property prices have fallen substantially in recent years due to the recession. We have been doing some research on house prices in the area and we are aware that a nearby 2 bed house (79 Cowley Close) sold for £140,000 in spring 2013. We have also noted that 88 Cowley Close was last sold for £142,500 in Dec 2005, and although house prices rose slightly through
to 2007, prices have subsequently fallen and are currently lower than 2007 prices.
As part of our offer we would like to ask that the following items are included with the sale:
· White goods, including fridge, dishwasher, chest freezer, washing machine & tumble dryer.
· Light fittings and bulbs throughout
· Blinds, curtains and rails throughout
· All other fixtures and fittings
· Garden Chiminea
Should this offer be acceptable, our conveyancer’s contact details can be provided without delay.
We look forward to hearing from you at your earliest opportunity.
Yours faithfully,"
As you can see our offer was £147,000, which is about 10.5% off the asking price. We have set ourselves a limit of £155,000, which base on 110 Cowley Close, we think is a fair price. I did also ask at the end of my email if he could forward the vendor's response in writing.
We had a response from the Agent this morning which went as follows:
"Hi Pete,
I thank you for your detailed offer, unfortunately it has been firmly rejected. As I said she is willing to negotiate from the asking price but at a drop of over £15K, is not acceptable to her. Especially to include all the white goods etc..
I thank you again for the marketing advice as to what has sold in the area, 1 clear comparable is number 110 sold May 2012 for £155,000. Although decorated very nicely, no garage and the positioning is not as sort after, over looked garden, and smaller kitchen.
Number 79, is a mid-terrace with no garage, and no parking. Hence a much lighter selling price.
As discussed we had previously had an acceptable offer on the property and although I’m bound not to discuss the exact figure it was starting at £16_,___, which has obviously given an expectation to the vendor, and has proved that the market (buyers) are willing to pay that level for that property.
I have tried to call you this morning to discuss but to no avail, I look forward to your response.
Thank you,"
As you can see he is trying to convince us, be it truth or myth, that the vendor won't accept anything under £160,000. This only represents 2.5% off asking price so I'm loath to believe his story of this previously accepted offer of £160something. He told me the offer was accepted only for the seller to lose his job. Funny, because we looked at another house with a different agent who gave us the exact same story!! He is also clearly trying to de-value 110 & 79 Cowley Close to make the asking price of £164,000 sound more reasonable.
Anyway, I responded to his email by simply asking again if we could have the vendor's response in writing (we want to know that she actually received it), to which he responded with a phone call explaining it was verbally discussed bla bla bla, but he could indeed get it in writing eventually. I left it by saying once we had that we could take the negotiation from there.
So if anyone can help us through this negotiation process we would both very VERY grateful. Any helpful input at all would be very much appreciated. The questions I have are; How long to wait until we proposed an increased offer? Should we respond by questioning his stance on offers over £160k? Should we say we'll walk away if anything under £160k will not be considered? How hardball should we be? We intended to increase our offer by £1,500 increments - is this too small?
Apologies for the lengthy post!
Thanks
Been a while since I was last on here posting. Me and my girlfriend, as the title suggests, are looking to by our first house. We had our 2nd viewing last night on a house we like and have made an offer in writing which has been rejected this morning. We would be really grateful for any advice on how to takle the negotiation process moving forward.
This is the house we have made an offer on:
88 Cowley Close
http://www.zoopla.co.uk/for-sale/details/28727947?tmad=c&tmcampid=44&utm_content=sale&utm_medium=email&utm_source=conf
2 bed semi with garage attached.
Asking price of £164,000.
Last sold for £142,500 on 2nd Dec 2005
We have done some research into house prices in the area/same close and have based our offer on the following 2 houses:
79 Cowley Close
http://www.zoopla.co.uk/property/79-cowley-close/southampton/so16-9we/22156170
2 bed terrace, sold for £140,000 in Feb 2013
110 Cowley Close
http://www.zoopla.co.uk/property/110-cowley-close/southampton/so16-9we/22156201
Pretty much the same house as 88 Cowley Close, only the garage has been converted into a dining room, it has a conservatory and the decor/finishing generally is in better condition.
Sold for £155,000 in May 2012
As said above, we made our offer in writing and went as follows:
"To whom it may concern,
Re: 88 Cowley Close, Southampton
Further to our viewings on 25th & 30th May 2013, we are pleased to be in a position to offer to purchase the freehold on the above property for £147,000 (one hundred and forty seven thousand pounds sterling). This offer is on the basis that the property is taken off the market upon acceptance of the offer and all future and current viewings are cancelled. The offer is also subject to survey and valuation.
Our offer reflects the current property market, the condition of the property and our strong position as prospective purchasers. Given that 88 Cowley Close is vacant at present, I trust our desire for a swift completion will recommend this offer to the vendor.
Position of Purchasers
We can confirm that we are first-time buyers and therefore in a chain-free position. Our finances are in place and a mortgage agreement in principle can be provided if required. We would look to instruct a solicitor to act on our behalf in any property purchase immediately upon acceptance of the offer. As a result we would be able to complete a sale quickly.
Property Market
As you are no doubt aware property prices have fallen substantially in recent years due to the recession. We have been doing some research on house prices in the area and we are aware that a nearby 2 bed house (79 Cowley Close) sold for £140,000 in spring 2013. We have also noted that 88 Cowley Close was last sold for £142,500 in Dec 2005, and although house prices rose slightly through
to 2007, prices have subsequently fallen and are currently lower than 2007 prices.
As part of our offer we would like to ask that the following items are included with the sale:
· White goods, including fridge, dishwasher, chest freezer, washing machine & tumble dryer.
· Light fittings and bulbs throughout
· Blinds, curtains and rails throughout
· All other fixtures and fittings
· Garden Chiminea
Should this offer be acceptable, our conveyancer’s contact details can be provided without delay.
We look forward to hearing from you at your earliest opportunity.
Yours faithfully,"
As you can see our offer was £147,000, which is about 10.5% off the asking price. We have set ourselves a limit of £155,000, which base on 110 Cowley Close, we think is a fair price. I did also ask at the end of my email if he could forward the vendor's response in writing.
We had a response from the Agent this morning which went as follows:
"Hi Pete,
I thank you for your detailed offer, unfortunately it has been firmly rejected. As I said she is willing to negotiate from the asking price but at a drop of over £15K, is not acceptable to her. Especially to include all the white goods etc..
I thank you again for the marketing advice as to what has sold in the area, 1 clear comparable is number 110 sold May 2012 for £155,000. Although decorated very nicely, no garage and the positioning is not as sort after, over looked garden, and smaller kitchen.
Number 79, is a mid-terrace with no garage, and no parking. Hence a much lighter selling price.
As discussed we had previously had an acceptable offer on the property and although I’m bound not to discuss the exact figure it was starting at £16_,___, which has obviously given an expectation to the vendor, and has proved that the market (buyers) are willing to pay that level for that property.
I have tried to call you this morning to discuss but to no avail, I look forward to your response.
Thank you,"
As you can see he is trying to convince us, be it truth or myth, that the vendor won't accept anything under £160,000. This only represents 2.5% off asking price so I'm loath to believe his story of this previously accepted offer of £160something. He told me the offer was accepted only for the seller to lose his job. Funny, because we looked at another house with a different agent who gave us the exact same story!! He is also clearly trying to de-value 110 & 79 Cowley Close to make the asking price of £164,000 sound more reasonable.
Anyway, I responded to his email by simply asking again if we could have the vendor's response in writing (we want to know that she actually received it), to which he responded with a phone call explaining it was verbally discussed bla bla bla, but he could indeed get it in writing eventually. I left it by saying once we had that we could take the negotiation from there.
So if anyone can help us through this negotiation process we would both very VERY grateful. Any helpful input at all would be very much appreciated. The questions I have are; How long to wait until we proposed an increased offer? Should we respond by questioning his stance on offers over £160k? Should we say we'll walk away if anything under £160k will not be considered? How hardball should we be? We intended to increase our offer by £1,500 increments - is this too small?
Apologies for the lengthy post!
Thanks
0
Comments
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I'm an advocate of not messing about.
Do you really love this house, and it's definitely the one, or are there others to see?
If you love it, I'd go back and say meet us half way at £155k. Tell them that's all the money you've got and you can't go any higher.
You'll soon find out whether they'll accept this or whether you need to look elsewhere0 -
I can understand some of the goods asked for in the price - eg carpets and curtains - but I expect asking for the "white goods" and chiminea were the cause of the "firmly" rejected, rather than just rejected.
It was a low offer you made - and then topped-off by asking her to give you some of her personal possessions.:eek:
She might have just gone back to her EA killing herself laughing and commenting "They'll be asking for the clothes in my wardrobe and rings from my jewellery box will they?:rotfl::rotfl: - as they are after some of my possessions as well as my house". On the other hand, she may not have a sense of humour and may have hit the roof at being asked for personal possessions.....and that was very very cheeky indeed to ask for her chiminea.0 -
Wow, loads of detail, so lets keep it short.
Step back, the Agent can see you're interested, and is now working on reeling you in. How much do you really like it? Enough to increase your offer? - in which case do so, but not in small jumps or you'll be see as someone who can always be teased up bit by bit.
But remember there is always another house out there - book some other viewings through the same Agent if possible.0 -
The agent and the seller are smelling blood and are looking to pull you in further.
Be firm.0 -
moneyistooshorttomention wrote: »I can understand some of the goods asked for in the price - eg carpets and curtains - but I expect asking for the "white goods" and chiminea were the cause of the "firmly" rejected, rather than just rejected.
It was a low offer you made - and then topped-off by asking her to give you some of her personal possessions.:eek:
She might have just gone back to her EA killing herself laughing and commenting "They'll be asking for the clothes in my wardrobe and rings from my jewellery box will they?:rotfl::rotfl: - as they are after some of my possessions as well as my house". On the other hand, she may not have a sense of humour and may have hit the roof at being asked for personal possessions.....and that was very very cheeky indeed to ask for her chiminea.
To put this into context, she hasn't lived in the house for some time (moved out whne broke up with her husband) and she had rented it out to her sold called 'freinds'. They didn't treat it very well so she kicked them out (friendship is over) and so she is now looking to sell up possibly to emmigrate.
So to ask for the white good which were used by the tenant I didn't think was so bad. Save her the hassel of moving unwanted white goods.0 -
moneyistooshorttomention wrote: »I can understand some of the goods asked for in the price - eg carpets and curtains - but I expect asking for the "white goods" and chiminea were the cause of the "firmly" rejected, rather than just rejected.
It was a low offer you made - and then topped-off by asking her to give you some of her personal possessions.:eek:
She might have just gone back to her EA killing herself laughing and commenting "They'll be asking for the clothes in my wardrobe and rings from my jewellery box will they?:rotfl::rotfl: - as they are after some of my possessions as well as my house". On the other hand, she may not have a sense of humour and may have hit the roof at being asked for personal possessions.....and that was very very cheeky indeed to ask for her chiminea.
Looking at the listing the house appears to be empty - all white goods are there, plus curtains etc., so I really don't think it unreasonable to clarify that the garden chimnea be included, especially if it has been left there by the vendor.I got ham but i'm not a hamster.....0 -
House prices are on the up. FACT. And the housing market it moving quickly. I think you have put far too much into your letter and they can read a mile off that your heart is set on that property, no way will they accept a low initial offer. And without being rude, I don't think you should have asked for the white goods and chimnea!
I am a FTB, saw a house at 169k and offered 164. I was told by the agent they wanted closer to the asking price as its good price etc and. Really wanted it so I maxed myself out to 167,500.
As it happens the survey came back with a value of £164 so they dropped it to that after survey.
If you really want the house, offer as near to asking as you can, and then re negotiate after the survey.0 -
Wow, loads of detail, so lets keep it short.
Step back, the Agent can see you're interested, and is now working on reeling you in. How much do you really like it? Enough to increase your offer? - in which case do so, but not in small jumps or you'll be see as someone who can always be teased up bit by bit.
But remember there is always another house out there - book some other viewings through the same Agent if possible.
Yes, we both really like this house. It is the 5th house we have seen and is actually the cheapest. Like I said, we are willing to go up to £155,000, but how many offers/how big increments is best to get there? Also, how long to wait before each rivised offer?0 -
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Just offer your max, if its not meant to be there will be other houses. You can knock them down at survey.0
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