Help with Neighbour dispute / fire escape

Walkthebasset

Hello,

just wondering whether anyone could give some advice, we are the ground floor garden flat or a georgian conversion, the two flats above have an emergency (iron) fire escape running to the back of the property (not a problem!).

We moved in 10 years ago (initially renting then we bought the property from the landlord) before we moved in we asked for a fence to be put up (we have a dog!) this was done and it ran alongside the fire escape. We have raised concerns about the fire escape being used as daily access before.

recently we had a valuation and some damp was appearing in the rear of the property in the back bedroom, the area behind it was being utilised by Flat 2 as a garden area, stacked with plant pots and watered (? not helping the damp) , basically the valuation caused us to check the boundaries and we found out we do in fact own this area, the access to the garden, the hard standing in front of the garages etc.

We contacted the managing agent (leasehold) who checked the title deeds and confirmed everything, we then wrote to all the flats (really nicely!) explaining what had come up etc.

The top flat are fine (i think they knew!) the middle flat (elderly couple with daughter living with them) have cut all communication, refused to answer texts, make any contact at all, and believe me we have been incredibly polite, even when we havent been able to park in front of our garage and have always been overlooked, and even when weve have to come into our property with them all sat in the sun having a cuppa in what turns out to be our garden! lol

heres a paste of the letter, I have taken the names out

Dear All,

Following a recent valuation for flat 1 the land deeds were investigated from the land registry for all the flats (I’ve attached them). These were then sent to ____________.
As you can see the boundaries for each property are highlighted in red.

The deeds show that Flat 1’s boundary extends to the hard standing in front of the garages level with next doors garage, with flat 3 having ownership of the right hand garage

I appreciate this may feel an awkward issue and the last thing we want to happen is for neighbourly relations to falter, but as the property ownership boundaries have been confirmed we would ask the following:

• All access/right of way to the property should be through the front door. Access to the rear of the property down the fire escapes, should only be in the event of an emergency, or to take out rubbish/recycling out to the bins.

• The area directly behind the north facing extension of flat 1 is cleared of pots and plants. Damp patches are appearing on the north facing wall and watering/plant cover was identified as a possible cause. This area will be reutilised & repainted.

• Access to the hard standing in front of the garages and access to them is limited to Flat’s 1 & 3 unless with prior permission.

We have contacted

---

(who have received copies of these and also photos of the property) who have confirmed ownership and the above, and will be writing to us all shortly to document.

We will ensure the security of the rear of the property by having a lockable gate put in place at the end of the walkway with the bins, we are happy to place the bins out once a week for everyone. If this is not agreeable to all then we can place the gate forward of the bins so that they can be accessed via the rear of the property.

We will let you know when the gate will be installed. Our current fence will remain in place until this time then it will be removed and our current gate and fencing replaced with low level fence and gate.

With regards to the access (_____ I’m aware that the flat is empty at the moment so this may be a good time to get things in place), ~~~~~~~ I know you will be disappointed with this and we understand that.

I appreciate this is a difficult issue and one that until we saw the deeds of ownership we were not aware of. We will let you know when the gate will be installed.

Thanks for your understanding

... So.... nearly a week on and nothing.aside from being unfriended on facebook by the daughter (shes mid 50's!) lol ... the areas still full of plants though they have stopped parking in front of our garage and on the hard standing (which was a bugbear!) ... its a shame they wont speak or even acknowledge but as much as we have all got along for ten years they can be rather prickly and have harranged the neighbours in the top flat on and off for years through banging on the ceiling etc... the managing agents said ' i think they probably knew' which we kind of think is the case. So how long do we give them before asking them to move the pots etc , technically they are on our property but am not going to move them in case I get in trouble! I was thinking of sending another letter this week with ' sorry you havent felt able to talk to us or have any input into the discussion, please move them by...'

Thanks for bearing with me! any ideas welcome!

Chris x::cool:

Ivana_Tinkle

I think your letter is a perfect example of how to deal with this sort of thing - polite and friendly and accommodating. Obviously your neighbours were never going to be happy about it, but if they've decided to be offended then really that's up to them.

I'd carry on being cheerful and polite and pretend not to notice the Facebook thing. Re the pots, you could always try a slightly passive-aggressive, "Do you need some help moving the pots? Shall we come down on Saturday afternoon and do it together?" with a big cheesy grin.

richardw

What exactly are you expecting them to do?

PasturesNew

I think this bit might be a bit cheeky:

All access/right of way to the property should be through the front door. Access to the rear of the property down the fire escapes, should only be in the event of an emergency, or to take out rubbish/recycling out to the bins.

Presumably the other residents have a right to pass/repass on foot.

neverdespairgirl

Walkthebasset wrote: »

' sorry you havent felt able to talk to us or have any input into the discussion, please move them by...'

Thanks for bearing with me! any ideas welcome!

Chris x::cool:

I wouodn't phrase it like that - I appreciate you're trying to be friendly, but when they aren't, it could sound patronising.

I can see you don't want to be rude, but they are being rude, so I'd stick to being formal.

"Further to my letter of 14th May 2013, please remove all your property from the XXX area by XXX date [[I'd give 7 days, or 14 if you are feeling generous]. If there is a particular difficulty in doing so within this time, please contact me and we can discuss it further."

Angelicdevil

Ivana_Tinkle wrote: »

I think your letter is a perfect example of how to deal with this sort of thing - polite and friendly and accommodating. Obviously your neighbours were never going to be happy about it, but if they've decided to be offended then really that's up to them.

I'd carry on being cheerful and polite and pretend not to notice the Facebook thing. Re the pots, you could always try a slightly passive-aggressive, "Do you need some help moving the pots? Shall we come down on Saturday afternoon and do it together?" with a big cheesy grin.

Or if being nice doesn't work, gather it all up and take it round to it's owners and then reclaim your land.

LEJC

Instead of sending the second letter,I would actually knock on the door and ask them face to face.
explain that its been some time since you sent the letter and as yet the pots have not been moved,and suggest that you could help if they are heavy...

By approaching face to face it clearly demonstrates that you are not going to leave it unchallenged.

These neighbour disputes can be crazy...I have an ongoing issue with mine at the moment...I think they dont want to get into even a "hello" with me as they will check that we are not around before they go in or out....last week it looked like they were going out as they were all stood on the garden path,but the kids were hurried back in the house when they saw my husband walking along the road,only to reappear once our front door was firmly closed!

laurel7172

You say you've been there ten years. Are you absolutely sure a right of access hasn't been established by now?

Walkthebasset

laurel7172 wrote: »

You say you've been there ten years. Are you absolutely sure a right of access hasn't been established by now?

thanks for all the replies, yep ten years, no ones ever queried it before!! its more fool us really, all the paperwork and solicitors stuff has been checked. theres no right of access. Going to give them a few days, wait for the letter from the managing agent then ring them or go up to ask them if theyd like a hand moving stuff.

am trying to be patient! its frustrating and kinda sad theyre being so isolative, its difficult to describe the layout without attaching photos!

dont fancy going up there at present, they can be, quite challenging.

fingers crossed, the couple are due to return to their second home soon leaving the daughter in situ.

will keep you posted!

c:eek:

Walkthebasset

PasturesNew wrote: »

I think this bit might be a bit cheeky:


Presumably the other residents have a right to pass/repass on foot.

nope! ironically the houses either side have bins out the front built into the front raised garden, we dont so we are offering access, tempted just to put the new gate in so that the bins are behind so they never hsve to come through but thats just nasty! we are open for discussion ! but still silence and general atmosphere!

bex0309

I think you have been really polite considering their attitude.

If they won't answer the door or reply I would send another letter that said: As we have notified you of the situation and requests to remove property from this area have been ignored, if items are not removed by x date then we will remove them.

So they will either have to move them or you move them and they have no reason to complain as you have given them notice.