Am I paying "too much" to her?

paulineb_2

Tiggs wrote: »

Situation is simple enough - 20 years married, 4 kids. Me and wifey are co-directors in a business.....that since we separated she has ceased to work for so I generate 100% of the income now.

Currently - I rent and she chills at home .....we both draw a div from our company of about 3-4k per month, each. For her that covers the mortgage and all bills and leaves plenty to get her hair done

My plan now is that I need to move towards divorce (I had hoped to try again, but she isnt keen)

I looked on the CSA website and, stone me, the legal obligation I have seems quite low???? I assumed with 4 kids I'd be paying her most of my money......but it looks like thats not the case and single mums get quite a grim deal?

She helped me build my business by raising the kids while I worked so I want her to be comfy....however, she also wants to walk away from it so she cant expect to have a lifestyle on a parr with had she stayed.

My plan was to cover the mortgage until the kids are gone from the house (youngest is 6) then she can keep the house and the equity and do what she wants (prob about £150k in it right now....or she could sell now and take the cash)

On top of the mortgage (£1k per month) I was going to pay another £1.5k a month.......with tax credits she'll get another £500 ish and child benifit too. Now, thats not quite what she picks up right now so my fear was she'd kick off and be right to do so......but my limited reading on this seems to suggest that a free house, £1.5k from me, £500 tax credits and £300 kid benifits (and she could always get a job!) is actually a deal she would be daft to argue with?

WOuld that be a fair assessment?

I'm seeing a solicitor soon but just wanted peoples "real world" feelings on it? Sometimes you cant see the wood for the trees and hearing others opinions (at least on what seems fair and what isnt) helps greatly!

You have an obligation to pay for your kids, less of an obligation to keep your ex in a lifestyle shes used to being accustomed to.

Can she not start working for the business again even part time.

Tbh, tax credits as you say, not your call, if her income dropped and she had to claim them and shes entitled, thats up to HMRC to pay her them.

An amount for your kids and enough to pay the bills and mortgage until you both decide whether the house is going to be sold or not. Fair enough.

Or drop what you are paying and she can claim what shes entitled to from elsewhere or go and try and get another job.

I agree, in the long term, its a lawyer who will give you advice on what assets will be split after the divorce.

HoneyNutLoop

I think you need professional advice on this one.

Your business and you are separate legal entities. That's kinda the whole point of limited companies. And in the same way that you only have limited liability for your company's debts, to the extent of your share values, your company has no liability for your debts or your child maintenance. That has to come from your personal pot of money: I.e. income you are liable to pay tax on, not income your company is liable to pay tax on.

The problem I can see you facing is that if your ex is a co-director and has equal shares, you can't unilaterally decide to take that away from her because you've split. Yes the company may have no asset value, and may generate no income if you don't work, but that doesn't stop it being part her company too (at whatever ratio you both own shares). So if the company keeps going the way it has, she is still legally due her percentage of whatever dividends are voted, and then you could be liable to pay her 19% (csa 3 - is that right?) of the gross income you personally are paid from the company, on top. The dividends paid to her are not money from you, but money from the company. It may seem like splitting hairs, but you legally are not one and the same.

To reiterate, my advice is seek professional advice.

PreludeForTimeFeelers

HoneyNutLoop wrote: »

I think you need professional advice on this one.

Your business and you are separate legal entities. That's kinda the whole point of limited companies. And in the same way that you only have limited liability for your company's debts, to the extent of your share values, your company has no liability for your debts or your child maintenance. That has to come from your personal pot of money: I.e. income you are liable to pay tax on, not income your company is liable to pay tax on.

The problem I can see you facing is that if your ex is a co-director and has equal shares, you can't unilaterally decide to take that away from her because you've split. Yes the company may have no asset value, and may generate no income if you don't work, but that doesn't stop it being part her company too (at whatever ratio you both own shares). So if the company keeps going the way it has, she is still legally due her percentage of whatever dividends are voted, and then you could be liable to pay her 19% (csa 3 - is that right?) of the gross income you personally are paid from the company, on top. The dividends paid to her are not money from you, but money from the company. It may seem like splitting hairs, but you legally are not one and the same.

To reiterate, my advice is seek professional advice.

Yup, a new case with 4QCs would be on the 2012 scheme.

clearingout

krashovrload wrote: »

++

I used to work with that guy (back in the 90s and under CSA1 rules) - wife had an affair and ended the marriage. He left her in the family home as she had the 3 children to look after whilst he ended up in a cramped bedsit and then he got clobbered by the CSA for maintenance...

++

for every ex 'couple' in the situation you describe, there is a NRP living it up with the 'other person', whilst a cheated on PWC struggles to work full time, juggle childcare and keep a roof over their children's heads. Usually without maintenance from the other parent, or if paid, paid at the £5 rate.

mania112

kevin137 wrote: »

My thinking is that you/she/both of you are the reason the UK is in the mess it is in...

TAX CREDITS...???

With that as an income...???

!!!!!!...!!!

Totally unnecessary and immature comment.

You're completely missing the fact that he's paying more than his fair share of income tax and NIC.

You think this man's situation is causing the UK to be in a mess? How about those who take and contribute zero???

He also seems to want to pay above and beyond the necessary maintenance.

Nothing to criticize here.

Mojisola

If your youngest is only 6, you have years of child maintenance ahead of you. Don't agree to something very generous that's doable now but may be very difficult to keep to in ten or fifteen years' time when your life might be quite different.

kevin137

mania112 wrote: »

Totally unnecessary and immature comment.

You're completely missing the fact that he's paying more than his fair share of income tax and NIC.

You think this man's situation is causing the UK to be in a mess? How about those who take and contribute zero???

He also seems to want to pay above and beyond the necessary maintenance.

Nothing to criticize here.

Really...???

Read what i wrote, when i made that comment i said "you/she/both"... Not YOU

And if you think it is ok to draw a dividend of in his own words... "we both draw a div from our company of about 3-4k per month, each." and then rape the country for another £500 a week then more fool you...!!!

That is £6,000 a year, more than a lot of people pay in tax... So please tell me... Who's money is she stealing should she in fact be receiving this dividend and taking WTC for £500 a month...???

Or is this a victimless crime that you are happy to see happen...

Which led to my comment that this is what is bringing this country down, it is all too often very acceptable behaviour to do this... And i for one, should i be a uk tax payer, would in fact be up in arms about it...!!!

Sp please do preach to me what is a childish comment, because i feel that i made my point, and gave advice on his best course of action, and that is that...

But if this woman can so easily rip of the government, then think how badly she is going to abuse the system to obtain as much as possible from what appears to be someone doing the right thing and supporting his kids... That is until there is nothing left to get or he is bankrupt, and she then has every penny of his and the taxpayers money...!!!

Personally, i would be applying for custody, reporting her for fraud and making sure she ended up in prison...! But that is because this is what causes so much hardship in the UK...

shegirl

kevin137 wrote: »

Really...???

Read what i wrote, when i made that comment i said "you/she/both"... Not YOU

And if you think it is ok to draw a dividend of in his own words... "we both draw a div from our company of about 3-4k per month, each." and then rape the country for another £500 a week then more fool you...!!!

That is £6,000 a year, more than a lot of people pay in tax... So please tell me... Who's money is she stealing should she in fact be receiving this dividend and taking WTC for £500 a month...???

Or is this a victimless crime that you are happy to see happen...

Which led to my comment that this is what is bringing this country down, it is all too often very acceptable behaviour to do this... And i for one, should i be a uk tax payer, would in fact be up in arms about it...!!!

Sp please do preach to me what is a childish comment, because i feel that i made my point, and gave advice on his best course of action, and that is that...

But if this woman can so easily rip of the government, then think how badly she is going to abuse the system to obtain as much as possible from what appears to be someone doing the right thing and supporting his kids... That is until there is nothing left to get or he is bankrupt, and she then has every penny of his and the taxpayers money...!!!

Personally, i would be applying for custody, reporting her for fraud and making sure she ended up in prison...! But that is because this is what causes so much hardship in the UK...

With dividends like that she wouldn't/shouldn't be entitled to tax credits. Does the op mean if she becomes no longer part of the business?

shoe*diva79

kevin137 wrote: »

Really...???

Read what i wrote, when i made that comment i said "you/she/both"... Not YOU

And if you think it is ok to draw a dividend of in his own words... "we both draw a div from our company of about 3-4k per month, each." and then rape the country for another £500 a week then more fool you...!!!

That is £6,000 a year, more than a lot of people pay in tax... So please tell me... Who's money is she stealing should she in fact be receiving this dividend and taking WTC for £500 a month...???

Or is this a victimless crime that you are happy to see happen...

Which led to my comment that this is what is bringing this country down, it is all too often very acceptable behaviour to do this... And i for one, should i be a uk tax payer, would in fact be up in arms about it...!!!

Sp please do preach to me what is a childish comment, because i feel that i made my point, and gave advice on his best course of action, and that is that...

But if this woman can so easily rip of the government, then think how badly she is going to abuse the system to obtain as much as possible from what appears to be someone doing the right thing and supporting his kids... That is until there is nothing left to get or he is bankrupt, and she then has every penny of his and the taxpayers money...!!!

Personally, i would be applying for custody, reporting her for fraud and making sure she ended up in prison...! But that is because this is what causes so much hardship in the UK...

If the OP pays as CM. and not a div then the ex is ENTITLED to that plus any benefits she may be ENTITLED to. She wont be ripping off the government, its her ENTITLEMENT.

Your post is utterly ridiculous. She hasn't committed any fraud, there is no evidence that the children should be taken away from her and given to the OP and why on earth should she be put in prison?

Unbelievable! Your worst post of 'advice' EVER!

shoe*diva79

OP - whatever you agree with your ex now does not have to be set in stone forever. Circumstances change and if you decide to be extra generous now but in a few years find that its no longer sustainable then some negotiation to change your agreement will be needed.

Keep a good civil relationship with your ex (makes literally everything easier!).