meter tampering

k4n3y

sorry don't know what an RPU is,guy looked like a normal engineer to me,he exchanged meter and said they would probably investigate and get back to me and that was it.

ptwparkinson

On the 16 th November 2012 , our takeaway was visited by British Gas and my wife waspresent . She was told that the meter was to be taken away and replaced becauseof a possible fault with the existing meter . My wife was not told that yoususpected the meter had been interfered with and if you did tell her somethingalong these lines it was not stated clearly enough . She was given a letterwhich stated at the top of the letter – Important Notice – we entered yourproperty today and removed your gas meter for testing . It was explained whyfurther down and into the letter , however , my wife only read the top part ofthe letter and to her knowledge and recollection she was not verbally told thatthere was any reason to believe that the meter had been tampered with . If shewas told verbally that there was a suspicion of tampering she would havecontacted myself immediately . I would have attended and I would have calledthe police immediately in response to the situation . There should have been anindependent body in attendance to witness any alleged tampering which as far asI now understand would have been suggested by a broken seal . Correct me if Iam wrong here .

First and foremost I am saying that neither my wife nor Iwould ever think of tampering with the meter . We are not cheats and we abideby the law at all times . My parents worked thirty years doing charitable worksfor the Mentally Handicapped Childrens Society and raised a substantial amountof monies for the charity over the years . This is the background that I camefrom . I worked for in the TV/Film industry for 33 years .

My wife is from a very hard working Chinese Malaysian familyand none of them have ever had problemswith the law . My wife is extremely hard working and industrious and herbackground is unblemished .

Wewelcome you taking us to court as we have nothing to hide and this will affordus the opportunity of seeing that justice is done. Neither my wife nor Ihave any criminal record and so your erroneous accusation brings shame onour family name of Woods. Knowing that we are innocent (the world of fiddlingmeters is alien to our culture and is something we wouldn't evenbegin to know how to do!) we give you advance warning that we shall beconsulting with our solicitor about your false accusation which has nowinflicted much grief on my wife and myself. I have been suffering from severepalpitations because with us being the innocent parties this is an outrage! Atthe end of the day we are honest, law abiding, hard working people tryingour best to survive the current economic crisis and yet we are beingaggressively pursued by your organisation.

I mention the aboveto illustrate the kind of people that you are dealing with here . We justwouldn`t cheat and tamper with our gas meter or break the law in any way .

Besides which , tampering with a meter could lead to a gasexplosion . Would we take that chance with our sons being present plus thepotential danger to our tenants above the shop ?

The meter was taken away and tested . My wife had filed awaythe letter that she was given and I did not see it until after you had writtento inform us that the results of your tests had allegedly shown that the meterhad been tampered with .

I telephoned yourself to discuss and I told you in nouncertain terms that we had not tampered with the meter at any time . I alsoinformed yourself that neither I or my wife would know how to tamper with ameter . I asked you what the evidence was and you told me that a meter runsforwards and that there was evidence of reverse , backwards wear on the cogswhich would suggest that the meter had been running in reverse . We haveabsolutely no idea how this could have happened . The meter was installed byBritish Gas and it was their responsibility to ensure that the meter wasproperly installed .

I asked you about time factors and you said that the weardoes not show when this happened ie whether it was 7 years ago , 4 years ago ,2 years ago or whatever .

During our discussion we arrived at the agreement that inorder to fiddle the

£ 15,686.39 amount that you are saying was probably used butnot recorded , the meter would have to be put into reverse on a regular basisover the years . And if the meter had been tampered with I would have thoughtthat you would have suspected something a lot earlier on during and after meterreadings and other visits . There would of course have been the constant riskof a gas explosion if my recent research is correct .

I have suggested that you continue to take readings from thenew meter over the next twelve months or maybe 6 months and this would showthat the consumption is at the same level more or less as we have been billedfor over the years . You rejected this idea and insulted me by saying that wecould close up for a month and not tell you so that the readings would showless consumption . Well , we have closed for at least 4 weeks every year sincewe opened so we are not consuming for 52weeks per year anyway . We are open 6 nights per week from 5 pm until 11 pm .Between 5 and 7 during the week we may do 3 meals on average . It is thenmoderately busy between 7 and 9 pm and after 9 pm it dies a death until closingtime and we may do 3 or 4 meals in this time . Weekends are busier , but Iwouldn`t say that we are ever really rushed off our feet .

My wife does the majority of the cooking and her son by herprevious marriage is our assistant chef and our own eldest son works for 2hours on Fridays nights and Saturday nights just to help out . So , as you cansee we are a small family run business . We actually should be taking much morebut we are probably not in the best of positions

---

it can be impossible topark outside and there is not much footfall of the right kind to bring inpassing trade AND the global recession is biting very hard indeed .

Our takings aregenerally in the region of £ 850.00 per week which is quite low , however weare trawling through a recession / financial crisis which has lasted longerthan the war against Nazi Germany and most businesses are suffering at themoment . We are surviving and keeping our heads above water and I have beendisappointed for many years before the recession even about the low level oftakings . But , the business feeds our family , my wife takes roughly £ 100.00per week in wages and I probably earn something like £ 70.00 per week fordeliveries and I am never paid this money because it just goes back into thebusiness .

I asked you how you had arrived at the figure of £ 15,686.39and you said that it was based on tables for the equipment that we use . Yousaid that there was a 6 or 7 burner unit and a 4 burner unit . My wife hasstated that she only uses two of the burners in the shop kitchen and she onlyuses the 4 burner unit located in the basement once or twice a week for cookingthe curry sauces and even then she only uses two of the burners . So , assumingwe are only using the two burners in general and the two burners downstairsonce or twice per week , what do your calculations estimate our usage at now ?

There are no other gas appliances in our shop or in thebuilding . There are 3 flats upstairs which are rented out and these are allelectric .

The £ 15,686.39 figure would be more correct if we weretaking £ 2,500.00 to

£ 3,000.00 which is what we felt was a possibility when wefirst opened . Sadly , this is far from reality and sometimes I wish that I hadnever agreed to open the takeaway in the first place .

Our accounts are handled by our accountant and everything ison record to show our takings over the years . We look forward to presentingthese in court , we will then also have the opportunity to prove that yourreadings with the new meter are consistent with our argument .

My wife has been going through previous readings andbillings very , very carefully and the readings and bills are totallyconsistent with the business takings . There are a lot of inconsistencies inyour readings and in your bills and we would need to go through all of this inminute detail with yourselves . The new meter shows that we have consumed 67units between the 16th November and the 11th December .

My wife suffered a fall on Friday of last week because ofher concern and worries about this issue . We visited our GP today and she hasbeen asked to attend the x ray unit in order to have her elbow joint examinedand x rayed . She has had great difficulty getting to sleep since your letterdated 16 th November 2012 and the GP has prescribed herbal sleeping pills . Wehave both suffered from lack of concentration , worry and anxiety because weare constantly distracted by the thoughts of your allegations and your accusations .









I have a few questions in summary:



1. Whywasn't my wife told the exact nature of the call by your officials (this deniedme the right of being present) ?

2. Whywere the police not involved in light of the magnitude and seriousness of theissue ?

3. Hasthe meter been submitted to an independent body, if so who?

4. Haveyou any evidence of the meter seal having been tampered with? You mentionedthat sometimes a hoover attachment is used to suck the meter readings backwardswhich is pure madness because from what I understand , one would have touncouple the gas pipe and attach the hoover tube

---

would this not allow gasto leak out and potentially cause a fire ? Why not install digital meters sothat the meter cannot be reversed ?

5. Was the old meter located anywhere else before it wasinstalled in our premises ?

6. The marks on the reverse of the yolk could have beenthere since manufacture .

espresso

ptwparkinson wrote: »

On the 16 th November 2012.........................

Does anyone else remember Jackanory!

C_Mababejive

Theres a lot of it about...

Cardew

All this happened a year ago!

Have I missed something? or have the amount of the bills been given?

Hoovers to run meters backwards? Surely that was stopped when they stopped customers 'reversing' their meters so they ran backwards?

Blackbeard_of_Perranporth

I guess newbie owns some Chinese takeawy!

chanz4

On the 16 th November 2012 , our takeaway was visited by British Gas and my wife waspresent . She was told that the meter was to be taken away and replaced becauseof a possible fault with the existing meter . My wife was not told that yoususpected the meter had been interfered with and if you did tell her somethingalong these lines it was not stated clearly enough . She was given a letterwhich stated at the top of the letter – Important Notice – we entered yourproperty today and removed your gas meter for testing . It was explained whyfurther down and into the letter , however , my wife only read the top part ofthe letter and to her knowledge and recollection she was not verbally told thatthere was any reason to believe that the meter had been tampered with . If shewas told verbally that there was a suspicion of tampering she would havecontacted myself immediately . I would have attended and I would have calledthe police immediately in response to the situation . There should have been anindependent body in attendance to witness any alleged tampering which as far asI now understand would have been suggested by a broken seal . Correct me if Iam wrong here .

First and foremost I am saying that neither my wife nor Iwould ever think of tampering with the meter . We are not cheats and we abideby the law at all times . My parents worked thirty years doing charitable worksfor the Mentally Handicapped Childrens Society and raised a substantial amountof monies for the charity over the years . This is the background that I camefrom . I worked for in the TV/Film industry for 33 years .

My wife is from a very hard working Chinese Malaysian familyand none of them have ever had problemswith the law . My wife is extremely hard working and industrious and herbackground is unblemished .

Wewelcome you taking us to court as we have nothing to hide and this will affordus the opportunity of seeing that justice is done. Neither my wife nor Ihave any criminal record and so your erroneous accusation brings shame onour family name of Woods. Knowing that we are innocent (the world of fiddlingmeters is alien to our culture and is something we wouldn't evenbegin to know how to do!) we give you advance warning that we shall beconsulting with our solicitor about your false accusation which has nowinflicted much grief on my wife and myself. I have been suffering from severepalpitations because with us being the innocent parties this is an outrage! Atthe end of the day we are honest, law abiding, hard working people tryingour best to survive the current economic crisis and yet we are beingaggressively pursued by your organisation.

I mention the aboveto illustrate the kind of people that you are dealing with here . We justwouldn`t cheat and tamper with our gas meter or break the law in any way .

Besides which , tampering with a meter could lead to a gasexplosion . Would we take that chance with our sons being present plus thepotential danger to our tenants above the shop ?

The meter was taken away and tested . My wife had filed awaythe letter that she was given and I did not see it until after you had writtento inform us that the results of your tests had allegedly shown that the meterhad been tampered with .

I telephoned yourself to discuss and I told you in nouncertain terms that we had not tampered with the meter at any time . I alsoinformed yourself that neither I or my wife would know how to tamper with ameter . I asked you what the evidence was and you told me that a meter runsforwards and that there was evidence of reverse , backwards wear on the cogswhich would suggest that the meter had been running in reverse . We haveabsolutely no idea how this could have happened . The meter was installed byBritish Gas and it was their responsibility to ensure that the meter wasproperly installed .

I asked you about time factors and you said that the weardoes not show when this happened ie whether it was 7 years ago , 4 years ago ,2 years ago or whatever .

During our discussion we arrived at the agreement that inorder to fiddle the

£ 15,686.39 amount that you are saying was probably used butnot recorded , the meter would have to be put into reverse on a regular basisover the years . And if the meter had been tampered with I would have thoughtthat you would have suspected something a lot earlier on during and after meterreadings and other visits . There would of course have been the constant riskof a gas explosion if my recent research is correct .

I have suggested that you continue to take readings from thenew meter over the next twelve months or maybe 6 months and this would showthat the consumption is at the same level more or less as we have been billedfor over the years . You rejected this idea and insulted me by saying that wecould close up for a month and not tell you so that the readings would showless consumption . Well , we have closed for at least 4 weeks every year sincewe opened so we are not consuming for 52weeks per year anyway . We are open 6 nights per week from 5 pm until 11 pm .Between 5 and 7 during the week we may do 3 meals on average . It is thenmoderately busy between 7 and 9 pm and after 9 pm it dies a death until closingtime and we may do 3 or 4 meals in this time . Weekends are busier , but Iwouldn`t say that we are ever really rushed off our feet .

My wife does the majority of the cooking and her son by herprevious marriage is our assistant chef and our own eldest son works for 2hours on Fridays nights and Saturday nights just to help out . So , as you cansee we are a small family run business . We actually should be taking much morebut we are probably not in the best of positions

---

it can be impossible topark outside and there is not much footfall of the right kind to bring inpassing trade AND the global recession is biting very hard indeed .

Our takings aregenerally in the region of £ 850.00 per week which is quite low , however weare trawling through a recession / financial crisis which has lasted longerthan the war against Nazi Germany and most businesses are suffering at themoment . We are surviving and keeping our heads above water and I have beendisappointed for many years before the recession even about the low level oftakings . But , the business feeds our family , my wife takes roughly £ 100.00per week in wages and I probably earn something like £ 70.00 per week fordeliveries and I am never paid this money because it just goes back into thebusiness .

I asked you how you had arrived at the figure of £ 15,686.39and you said that it was based on tables for the equipment that we use . Yousaid that there was a 6 or 7 burner unit and a 4 burner unit . My wife hasstated that she only uses two of the burners in the shop kitchen and she onlyuses the 4 burner unit located in the basement once or twice a week for cookingthe curry sauces and even then she only uses two of the burners . So , assumingwe are only using the two burners in general and the two burners downstairsonce or twice per week , what do your calculations estimate our usage at now ?

There are no other gas appliances in our shop or in thebuilding . There are 3 flats upstairs which are rented out and these are allelectric .

The £ 15,686.39 figure would be more correct if we weretaking £ 2,500.00 to

£ 3,000.00 which is what we felt was a possibility when wefirst opened . Sadly , this is far from reality and sometimes I wish that I hadnever agreed to open the takeaway in the first place .

Our accounts are handled by our accountant and everything ison record to show our takings over the years . We look forward to presentingthese in court , we will then also have the opportunity to prove that yourreadings with the new meter are consistent with our argument .

My wife has been going through previous readings andbillings very , very carefully and the readings and bills are totallyconsistent with the business takings . There are a lot of inconsistencies inyour readings and in your bills and we would need to go through all of this inminute detail with yourselves . The new meter shows that we have consumed 67units between the 16th November and the 11th December .

My wife suffered a fall on Friday of last week because ofher concern and worries about this issue . We visited our GP today and she hasbeen asked to attend the x ray unit in order to have her elbow joint examinedand x rayed . She has had great difficulty getting to sleep since your letterdated 16 th November 2012 and the GP has prescribed herbal sleeping pills . Wehave both suffered from lack of concentration , worry and anxiety because weare constantly distracted by the thoughts of your allegations and your accusations .









I have a few questions in summary:



1. Whywasn't my wife told the exact nature of the call by your officials (this deniedme the right of being present) ? Don't need to

2. Whywere the police not involved in light of the magnitude and seriousness of theissue ? Don't need to, unless breach of the peace, although the police will side with the rpu

3. Hasthe meter been submitted to an independent body, if so who?

Doesn't need to, only a qualified engineer needs to inspect.


4. Haveyou any evidence of the meter seal having been tampered with? You mentionedthat sometimes a hoover attachment is used to suck the meter readings backwardswhich is pure madness because from what I understand , one would have touncouple the gas pipe and attach the hoover tube

---

would this not allow gasto leak out and potentially cause a fire ? Why not install digital meters sothat the meter cannot be reversed ?

Thy can tell as it damages the internal cogs


5. Was the old meter located anywhere else before it wasinstalled in our premises ?

They can tell by usage, also your propertys previous usage

6. The marks on the reverse of the yolk could have beenthere since manufacture .

Not likely

ptwparkinson

I guess newbie owns some Chinese takeawy!

what exactly does that mean ?

we have owned and run this business since 2004

I am English -- my wife is Chinese and we keep it in the family with our own son and my stepson working there also

it seems to me by the comments that I have read so far that some people seem to think that we are guilty

if we were guilty I would have acted earlier by just selling up and telling British Gas to shove it where the sun don`t shine

I have been fighting this for nearly a year now and I just can`t believe their attitude and why they are taking such a position when it is clear that meter`s can develop faults -- all that thye have are some faint black marks on the reverse of the yolk that we sure as hell didn`t put there by any means

the report which came back from Scienco reported no damage to the diaphragm or anything else and that the seal was I ntact and undamaged --- so how the hell are we supposed to have tampered when there isn`t even any wear on the inner threads of the nuts and bolts --- and by the way --- the nut which would have to be taken off is about the circumference of an elephants neck

again --- if we had done this I would at this stage be doing a deal to pay back £ 3.50 per week or something like that pay or I`d borrow the money from my brother and pay him back as and when I could

no no no no no no --- we didn`t tamper with the meter

they will not give in and they are going to court next week to ask for disconnection and following through later on with a civil action

we have already been interviewed under caution by the Police and the Police and the CPS threw out the case --- insufficient evidence and the fact that the figures produced by British Gas just don`t add up

this is a serious problem because if they are allowed to get away with this what will they do to other people and let`s not forget how they have increased prices by approx. 10 % since 2011 practically year on year ---- and they are putting prices up again

---

what are their annual profits ??? how much is Chris Weston MD BG being paid as a remuneration package --- something like 2 million and his fees are about £ 5,000,000

whilst all the OAP`s are freezing throughout the winter , these people do not actually care --- they are totally immune to the misery which is out there

I cannot understand some of the comments about my post

one at the end of my post when I say that the black marks could have been there since manufacture and the comment was " not likely "

---

I was told by someone who used to work on meters that the marks could have been there since manufacture--- the meter may have been somewhere else before it was in our shop --- it would have gone back to be reversed to zero at their depot and this could account for the black marks --- and this is all they have --- their figure don`t stack up ---- there can`t be photographic evidence of some thing we didn`t do nor could there be video evidence or a witness statement saying they saw us doing anything illegal --- the meter is located in the shop window in full view --- the police and the public are walking past all of the time

the whole thing is ridiculous --- they won`t let go and insist on us paying in full or they will disconnect our supply

I am all for people who are guilty being prosecuted but we are totally innocent and if anyone wishes to say any different --- come and say it to my face and then you can read all of the e mails and look at the evidence for yourself and eventually you will see sense

chanz4

My guess is the industry seal was tampered, this allows more gas per unit

ptwparkinson

In reply to chanz4 -- in the report which was issued by Scienco it is stated that the seal was undamaged and intact