Pricing up a Patio

Naf

Howdy,

I'm trying to tot up what it's likely to cost for me to get a patio out back; but planning on doing the simple stuff myself.
I've worked out what I want and it's about 15sqm, but not just one x by y block;

https://www.dropbox.com/s/crszs261k90lqcb/Photo%2008-05-2013%2022%2011%2020.jpg

The house is the full length along the bottom, there's a fence to the right and the shaded block on the left is a brick shed/outbuilding. The blank space between the house & 'shed' is already concede over, and for the sake of simplicity I plan to let that be. There's also a drain and water cut-off that I've not put on the plan - right near the house.


As you can probably guess, the individual squares are the slabs I plan to use cut at the same scale as the rest. The path up beside the 'shed' is primarily for the bins, and where the planned patio path ends around the top I'm debating whether to cover with the same new slabs, or to use the ones currently along beside the house, where the patio is planned to go instead.

I plan to dig out the area for the patio myself & fill it with the sub base (MOT Type 1?). I'm reasonably confident I could lay the whole thing, but I'm leaning toward getting a professional in to actually lay the slabs - depending on the cost.

What I'm wondering:
- is the MOT Type 1 the right stuff. I know it's suitable, but is it also the most cost effective? The massive bulk bags from Wickes/B&Q are around £40, but probably loads more than I actually need.
- once I've laid the sub base, is it critical if it gets wet or left a few days, or will I need to arrange time so I can lay it and then get the rest laid quickly?
- I'm assuming it'll be cheaper if I also get the mortar to lay the slabs into? Is just a typical cement bag and sharp sand the right stuff? And how do I work out what weights to get for the given area/volume I need?
- how tricky is laying a good patio? If I was to do it myself (given that I'm reasonably handy), what bits do I need to look out for. Or, say I was to lay all the full slabs, then is it reasonable to get a pro to lay the trickier part-slabs and bits around drains?
- how much should I expect to pay for someone to just lay the slabs once I've done the base?

MX5huggy

Everything is covered on http://www.pavingexpert.com/

One of the best sites on the web.

Probably the most important things are you respect the dpc level of your house, and you have a fall on it so water flows where you want it to.

Naf

For an occasional use patio, do I really need to build a proper foundation & bed it in, or will it work OK laying the slabs down and packing them with some sharp sand?
Obviously this method will be less stable, require more maintenance and not last as long: but I'm only in a rented house anyway.

ian103

i would suggest a minimum of 75mm of crusher run / hardcore / mot 1 (100mm is better) then a 25/30mm sharp sand bed with a small amount of cement to stabilise, then screed off vevel and lay the slabs - it may be easier to dot and dab the slabs on mortar. the stone can withstand some rain but best not left open to heavy rain as the fines will be washed away.

cyclonebri1

Naf wrote: »

For an occasional use patio, do I really need to build a proper foundation & bed it in, or will it work OK laying the slabs down and packing them with some sharp sand?
Obviously this method will be less stable, require more maintenance and not last as long: but I'm only in a rented house anyway.

To be honest the use is irrelevant, it's raw nature you are against not human nature.

People pressure won't affect it, but frost and thaw and water and drought will, and to a much greater extent.

Bottom line is the garden/soil/ top surface flexes with nature.
Fix that rigid with sand and cement and concrete pavers and something gives;););)

Naf

PasturesNew wrote: »

My sister simply dug down deep enough .... made sure it was flat.... poured sand over the space, laid the slabs down, then put a cement/sand mix in the gaps and waited for it to rain. That was plenty good enough for the years she lived at that house.

How much traffic will the patio get?

The kids running around/scooters/bikes. Sitting out if the weather is nice, the odd BBQ.

By cement/sand mix you mean just the powder and let rain (/hosepipe) wet it to set?

cyclonebri1

You don't want the patio to be flat, it has to have a natural drain in the direction of your choice, away from the house as a rough guide.

And yes, to finish the joinst it's normal to use an almost dry sand cement mix, a little drier than would be used to build a sand castle.
Brush this in, smooth it with the brush handle or similar and the do the same again. Brush of the surplus, there will be enough moisture in the smie dry mix to set off even if it doesn'r rain for a while.;)

wrightk

ian103 wrote: »

i would suggest a minimum of 75mm of crusher run / hardcore / mot 1 (100mm is better) then a 25/30mm sharp sand bed with a small amount of cement to stabilise, then screed off vevel and lay the slabs - it may be easier to dot and dab the slabs on mortar. the stone can withstand some rain but best not left open to heavy rain as the fines will be washed away.

I know this post is a bit old but come on! you never dot and dab slabs.complete bodge

Naf

In the end I opted to do it myself, a pretty basic job; just 50mm sharp sand with a little cement mixed through. It'll need more maintenance, but its much cheaper; and not so permanent if the LL wants to take it out again.

cyclonebri1

wrightk wrote: »

I know this post is a bit old but come on! you never dot and dab slabs.complete bodge

Well I didn't suggest that, I guess someone did, but, it's far from a "complete bodge".

It actually ensures any movement occurs across joint lines rather than crack slabs, check out how the old guys do it, ;) and I don't mean Tommie and Charlie D:D:D

Naf

The finished job:
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/47763310/Photos/Photo%2027-05-2013%2018%2039%2027.jpg