storage heaters/electric central heating or gas?

nick74

Electrorad wrote: »

They are considerably cheaper to run than night storage heaters

Utter, utter rubbish.

mlee_2

Hi, I am new to this forum and have just read this thread and got utterly confused. I am in a gasless zone, can't get oil since (terrace house) and am looking at updating my heating system. I currently have storage heaters and supplement that with open fire.

I am considering under-tile heating for kitchen, bathroom and conservatory - will it be sufficient as primary heat and will it cost a lot to run? Do I need additional heater? Alternatives are Dimplex DuoHeat (storage + convection) or Karilel. I do like the idea of switching something on/setting a temperature when required so replacing with new storage heaters doesn't really appeal. The cost of the units are all approximately the same.

Any advice?

FBThree

Freezing_student wrote: »

Yer i'm pretty sure we are using it right but the problem in our flat is that it's drafty and because the storage heaters store heat i'm guessing that a drafty flat kind of acts like a forced convection to take the heat away from the storage heater. The flat is not well insulated

Thanks for your help

Sorry but surely one of the first things to do is solve the draft situation and the insulation situation? We found even just putting door insulation strips around the door helped keep heat in, as did curtains over external doors, blinds and curtains over windows, plus rugs over floors.

amtrakuk

mlee


I have come across Bionaire convector heaters in Argos. They have a remote control "pod" that you put on you're table, set the temp you want the room and let the heater click on and off to maintain that temp as the thermostat is in the remote not the heater. I have one in the kitchen and one in the living room.

They operate at Low setting 1.5 Kw or High 3Kw. One of the downsides is the noise of the fan. Its no quieter than a normal fan heater but obviously nosier than an oil filled rad. The advantages I can say for it is it keeps the room to the temp you set it, wall mountable, quick heating and doesn't look that bad. On the flip-side, then the heater turns off (room upto temp) you notice the heat loss (I guess abit like every convector heater/blowey heater). The fan can be a bit noisy if you like a quiet room to read a book. There is no option to keep the heat on but turn the fan off.

I did look at the delonghi top of the range convector heater with ECC - electronic climate control built in. Set the temp using the thermostat and it regulates the power between 1, 2 and 3 KW (I guess) to keep the room warm. There is a blower on it that you can switch off and the first night I had it I set the temp and fell asleep in the chair waking up at 3am to a sauna and 30 extra units used on the meter. OK thats my fault for not setting it right I guess. The reason i had to return it was it has a mechanical timer on it - thats right chinese water torture time. A very quick tick tick tick.

Don't make the same mistake I made of having 2 of them on the same ring main. I ended up blowing my fuse box up. But a cheap qualified electrician managed to rectify that by putting a new circuit breaker panel in and putting the heaters on their own separate circuit.

It seems an ideal heating solution for, if like me you spend alot of time out of the house and want a quick blast of heat when you get in.

Reading through the posts and as i mentioned before convector heaters and oil filled rads are two different beasts when it comes to quality of heat. I've come to the conclusion convection is good for quick heat where oil filled rads are good for a constant steady stream of heat IE bedrooms.

I have got the old style Glen/Dimplex oil filled panel heaters upstairs and find it better to keep them on 24/7 on low and over a period of a day the whole house is "Warm" - the same warmth of central heating. I know its expensive but hopefully wont be too much longer before the weather starts warming up and i can turn them off for the rest of the year.

I've recently converted to British Gas Click 4 tariff (13p for the first 900Kw/year then 5.8p thereafter). Last week I gave an over the phone reading and my whole house electric bill worked out at 185.00 for November and December.

Although the Bionaire is effective I am finding the fan noise conspicuous as I have to turn the tele volume up a notch or two so am considering changing it back to the trusty 1.2KW Glen panel heater.

Electrorad

To CARDEW,

Thanks for your latest rant.

The website simply presents the product and quotes bonafide data from a government recognised product efficiency test centre.

The Energy Saving Trust have the data and are discussing the system at its next meeting(later this month I believe)


The statement you keep making about all electric heating being 100% efficient at turning electric into heat is of course correct but the way that the heat is stored and/or dispersed can make a big difference.

If you understand the principal of storage heating then you will understand that heat energy can be stored and dispersed long after the electricity has been turned off. The media for storing the heat and the design for dispersing the heat makes all the difference and this can reduce the running costs.

An electric Iron may be 2kw and is 100% efficient at turning electric into heat, but try heating your room with it! It's not designed to do that!

We have many many letters from customers who have changed from night storage to our system and experienced sustantial savings in their electricity bills.

Electrorad

The ASA have approved 'running costs of 4p per hour' for our 2kw heater. In the living room this heater was tested in, a 3.4kw night store would be specified (Dimplex heating design tables). At full charge if economy 7 is costing 3p per kwh that's 10.2p per hour. At half charge 5.1p per hour.

That makes our heater considerably cheaper to run than the night storage heater!

amtrakuk

I havent had alot of experience of storage heaters and like the idea of the modern radiators but there seems to be alot of disagreement between running costs and not being an expert cant really comment.

Totally unrealistic but... If a salesman can come to my house stay here for a week and take measurements and readings for the week and if they think they can heat my house to the same standard and comfort for cheaper with their system then feel free come and fit my house out but only as long as its backed by the same salesman staying here the week after fitting and if it works out more expensive then they will refund all heater and installation costs and reinstate my old system then I'll go for it.

I'm not saying one system is better than the other as I don't know but I would need a 100% fully backed guarantee before I put the money on the table and the company putting their money where their mouth (or in this case fingers) is.

nick74

Electrorad wrote: »

The ASA have approved 'running costs of 4p per hour' for our 2kw heater. In the living room this heater was tested in, a 3.4kw night store would be specified (Dimplex heating design tables). At full charge if economy 7 is costing 3p per kwh that's 10.2p per hour. At half charge 5.1p per hour.

That makes our heater considerably cheaper to run than the night storage heater!

No it doesn't! You are not comparing like with like at all.

You don't seem to be aware that storage heaters only consume power during the 7 hours per day when the Economy 7 is on. For the remaining 17 hours they consume zilch.

The storage heater will consume a MAXIMUM of 7 hours at say 10.2p per hour, to heat the room for 24 hours. Total cost over 24 hours 10.2p x 7hrs =71.4P
Thats about 3p per hour over a 24 hour period.

Your heater costs 4p x 24hrs =96p
That's one third MORE expensive.

So, according to your own figures, your heater costs at least 24.6p per day MORE to run than a storage heater.

You've not really thought this through have you?

Electrorad

We all know that night storage heaters do not heat a room for 24 hours. We get call after call after call from people fed up with their system because the heat is gone in the afternoon/early evening. Ancillary heating is then needed at standard tariff. This is why storage heaters now have a convector or fan heater built in. The useful heat from a storage heater starts at around 7am. What use is heat during the night while asleep? Lets say the heat lasts from 7am to 7pm, this is 12 hours of heat. That may have cost 10.2p x 7 hours = 71.4p divided into 12 hours is 5.95p per hour. You must then add the cost of the ancillary heating.
The other issue is if the occupants are working regular hours then the heat provided between around 8.30am and 6pm has been paid for but is of no use.

nick74

Electrorad wrote: »

We all know that night storage heaters do not heat a room for 24 hours. We get call after call after call from people fed up with their system because the heat is gone in the afternoon/early evening. Ancillary heating is then needed at standard tariff. This is why storage heaters now have a convector or fan heater built in. The useful heat from a storage heater starts at around 7am. What use is heat during the night while asleep? Lets say the heat lasts from 7am to 7pm, this is 12 hours of heat. That may have cost 10.2p x 7 hours = 71.4p divided into 12 hours is 5.95p per hour. You must then add the cost of the ancillary heating.
The other issue is if the occupants are working regular hours then the heat provided between around 8.30am and 6pm has been paid for but is of no use.

How does any of that prove that your heaters are cheaper to run than storage heaters? When your heaters were tested did you, as a control, also test storage heaters under the same conditions? If not, why not?

How does it prove that your heaters are more efficient that any other electric heaters? Did you test other types of electric heater as a control?