POPLA Decisions

nigelbb

This is not a question of byelaws. The car park is owned by lfracombe Town Council & as these are parking places provided by a "traffic authority" then it's not relevant land so the keeper cannot be held responsible for any unpaid parking charges incurred by the driver.

The extract from POFA 2012 posted by Guys Dad gives full chapter & verse.

helpneeded2018

Decision Successful
Assessor Name
Assessor summary of operator case
The operator’s case is that a Parking Charge Notice (PCN) was issued due to failed to make a valid payment.

Assessor summary of your case
The appellant has provided a number of grounds for appeal these are: The operator has failed to comply with the strict requirements of the Protection of Freedoms Act (PoFA)2012. No evidence of Landowner Authority. The operator has not shown that the individual who it is pursuing is in fact the driver who may have been potentially liable for the charge. The Automatic Number Plate Recognition (ANPR) System is neither reliable nor accurate.

Assessor supporting rational for decision
From the evidence provided, I can see that the operator is pursuing the appellant as the registered keeper of the vehicle. Accordingly, the provisions laid out in the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 (PoFA 2012) will need to be followed in order to transfer liability from the keeper of the vehicle to the hirer of the vehicle. PoFA 2012, paragraph 4 (1) states “the creditor has the right to recover any unpaid parking charges from the keeper of the vehicle”. Section 13 (2) goes on to state that “the creditor may not exercise the right under paragraph 4 to recover from the keeper any unpaid parking charges specified in the notice to keeper if, within the period of 28 days beginning with the day after that on which that notice was given, the creditor is given – (a) A statement signed by or on behalf of the vehicle-hire firm to the effect that at the material time the vehicle was hired to a named person under a hire agreement; (b) A copy of the hire agreement; and (c) A copy of a statement of liability signed by the hirer under that hire agreement. After reviewing the document provided by the operator, I cannot see that the appellant has been provided with the hire documents, without these documents being provided I cannot be certain the appellant accept liability for PCN’s. It is the responsibility of the operator to confirm the terms and conditions of the car park have not been met on this occasion; the operator has failed to provide evidence that the appellant has been provided with the required documents and therefore I cannot determine the PCN has been issued correctly. While I note the appellant has raised further grounds for appeal, I do not need to consider these any further as I have allowed this appeal.


Keep up the good work guys! Have a great weekend! :beer:

Umkomaas

Excellent result @helpneeded2018. We've yet to see any PPC get the Notice to Hirer and all its essential paperwork right. Easy slam dunks at POPLA, provided the driver isn't identified.

Original thread:

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/5922261/britannia-parking-popla-appeal

PPC = Britannia

dg2019

Hi all,


I have read the threads on Gemini Parking Solutions and need some advice, last year (2018) I received at NTK for a Sunday in October 2016 when I parked in Chase Farm Hospital visiting the emergency unit. As the hospital was under construction there was no signage to pay to park and I was the only car in the car park!!! I have been fighting my case against Gladstone Solicitors as I ignored all letters from Gemini Parking to begin with as I know they are scammers, Gladstone Solicitors have continually been sending me letters I have asked for proof I parked there and heard nothing until now..


They have sent me the old NTK along with images of all the Gemini parking signs around Chase Farm which have no date as to when they was installed (these were 100% not there when I parked) my car has been captured on the ANPR footage going into the car park but there is no images of where I was parked and if Gemini even had the pay and display machines then (they didn't). Do I go back to Gladstones? I have emailed the Chase Farm PALs to ask for a date hen the pay and display machines were installed.


I need some advice where to go from now please..

Umkomaas

dg2019 wrote: »

Hi all,


I have read the threads on Gemini Parking Solutions and need some advice, last year (2018) I received at NTK for a Sunday in October 2016 when I parked in Chase Farm Hospital visiting the emergency unit. As the hospital was under construction there was no signage to pay to park and I was the only car in the car park!!! I have been fighting my case against Gladstone Solicitors as I ignored all letters from Gemini Parking to begin with as I know they are scammers, Gladstone Solicitors have continually been sending me letters I have asked for proof I parked there and heard nothing until now..


They have sent me the old NTK along with images of all the Gemini parking signs around Chase Farm which have no date as to when they was installed (these were 100% not there when I parked) my car has been captured on the ANPR footage going into the car park but there is no images of where I was parked and if Gemini even had the pay and display machines then (they didn't). Do I go back to Gladstones? I have emailed the Chase Farm PALs to ask for a date hen the pay and display machines were installed.


I need some advice where to go from now please..

Why on earth are you posting on a sticky thread dealing with 'POPLA Decisions'? Please start a new thread of your own for bespoke advice on your case.

Standupforyourself

nigelbb wrote: »

This is not a question of byelaws. The car park is owned by lfracombe Town Council & as these are parking places provided by a "traffic authority" then it's not relevant land so the keeper cannot be held responsible for any unpaid parking charges incurred by the driver.

The extract from POFA 2012 posted by Guys Dad gives full chapter & verse.

i included this exact extract in my appeal and highlighted the main points in yellow. Not sure what else i could have done. Would love to know who on here has successfully challenged on this point in court as it looks as if that is where this is heading.

DoaM

Shocking decision, Standupforyourself

Definitely worthy of a complaint to the Lead Adjudicator as the assessor has made a fundamental error in law.

Coupon-mad

i included this exact extract in my appeal and highlighted the main points in yellow. Not sure what else i could have done. Would love to know who on here has successfully challenged on this point in court as it looks as if that is where this is heading.

Wrong question, because first you need to head a robust complaint to John Gallagher (search the forum for his name to see previous complaints made to him, to avoid writing the wrong thing about it being 'unfair'/you disagree, etc).

You need to break it down into small chunks with quotes, like has been said already:

Ilfracombe Town Council is indisputably a ''traffic authority'', which means/includes:

(f)a parish or community council;

and the bay is indisputably, a:

“parking place” {with} ...the meaning given by section 32(4)(b) of the Road Traffic Regulation Act 1984;
https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1984/27/section/32

which says:


32 (4) (b)“parking place” means a place where vehicles, or vehicles of any class, may wait;

thus it is:


a parking place which is provided or controlled by a traffic authority;

Nothing says it has to be a parking place that's the subject of any statute or Order. It just has to be ''provided by'' any Council.

On your thread several of us have replied, so continue over there.

Your case should certainly be reviewed by POPLA as it's clear the Assessor didn't know how to answer that point about ''not relevant land'', and so buried it next to another point, with no answer or finding made at all!

Given your evidence, it's clearly not relevant land and the decision would have been obvious to an Assessor who knew that Council land where parking spaces are 'provided' for public use, is not, and never can be whilst under Council ownership, relevant land.

nigelbb

Coupon-mad wrote: »

Given your evidence, it's clearly not relevant land and the decision would have been obvious to an Assessor who knew that Council land where parking spaces are 'provided' for public use, is not, and never can be whilst under Council ownership, relevant land.

It doesn’t matter whether the parking space is intended for public use or not. It could be a parking space outside the town hall reserved for the mayor’s car. It’s provided by the council therefore not relevant land.

Coupon-mad

If it's a space provided for beneficial use of residents under the Housing Act, then it seems they *can* use a private company (but I would still say, until convinced otherwise, that it can't also be 'relevant land').

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?p=75337338#post75337338

Info came from IamEmanresu re a site called Leigh Park that he complained about.

Not that the Housing Act applies to this case, which is about a public P&D car park. Clearly the POPLA Assessor was clueless about what 'not relevant land/Council owned' actually meant.